21 Jun
2010
21 Jun
'10
11:55 a.m.
Some news:
* I still do not know where the 'concrete canvas' from Morphic is passed as
argument to a MOCanvas. Try to put a 'halt' in MOCanvas>>drawOn: and you
will see a long list of indirections that never ends (if your image is not
yet frozen ;)).
I just know that this is a FormCanvas that is passed. I also try to replace
all references in pharo of FormCanvas by RomeBalloonCanvas, but this is
still a FormCanvas that is passed to MOCanvas>>drawOn:.
Therefore I didn't find any good solution to be able to switch between one
kind of canvas to another kind. The MOCanvas is a morph, and I am not able
to control its opening.
* What I have been able to do, is to modify the MOBrowser to not add the
MOCanvas in the browser, but an ImageMorph built throught the
MOCanvas>>drawOn: method (setting myself a RomeBalloonCanvas as parameter).
It works, but as an image morph, you will not be able to interact (like
with the usual MOCanvas morph) . But you can already see how the
visializations are drawn by basically replacing the formCanvas by a
RomeBalloonCanvas.
For simple visualization (like DistributionMap for example) , there is no
big changes.
So to try it, first, load last Version ofAthens:
www.squeaksource.com/Athens
Then the last version of Mondrian in:
www.squeaksource.com/MondrianUsingRome
And then open any visualization (in the same way that you usally do)
2010/6/16 Alexandre Bergel <alexandre.bergel(a)inria.fr>
In that case, it is easy to use Mondrian with
RomeCairoCanvas in that
case...
something like "canvas drawOn: romeCairoCanvas" should do the thing.
Alexandre
On 16 Jun 2010, at 04:03, Cyrille Delaunay wrote:
from
Mondrian or package blueprint.
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Hello,
In the Rome examples, we create a Canvas on a 'Form' (and it's on this
Form that the drawing will be visible).
In all RomeExample, the form on which we display
is 'Display' (the class
representing the display screen), but we can choose
any other kind of Form.
So basically , if you want to use a
RomeCairoCanvas, you do:
|canvas|
canvas := RomeCairoCanvas on: Display (or any other kind of Form).
canvas drawRectangle: ...
....
canvas finish (=> to make the changes visible)
Then if you choose to display on a basic Form, I guess you can integrate
this Form
to a Morph (?).
2010/6/15 Alexandre Bergel <alexandre.bergel(a)inria.fr>
> but the example proposed by jean-remi is exactly the same as the one
proposed
by jannik a while ago
this is a
complex case.
Yes, I will work on it. I have to identify where the slowness comes from,
Alexandre
>
> Stef
>
> On Jun 15, 2010, at 2:46 PM, Alexandre Bergel wrote:
>
>>> I did not say that he did not say anything. I just said that it is
difficult to find where problems are by looking at a very complex case. When
the problems were raised, we did look into the issues, but it was just too
difficult especially when we had multiple problems in the same time.
>>>
>>> Now we are in the situation in which multiple people noticed multiple
problems, there are some fixes, but there are still problems left. So, we
have to dig deeper and we should do it more systematically by creating
simpler cases that reproduce the problem. It's not an issue of "I told you
so", it's an issue of "We need help to identify all problems" :).
>>
>> +1
>>
>> Alexandre
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 15 Jun 2010, at 14:01, Stéphane Ducasse wrote:
>>>
>>>> Doru
>>>>
>>>> Jannik said it several times - check the list. So do not tell him
that he did not want to help.
>>>>
>>>> Stef
>>>>
>>>> On Jun 15, 2010, at 1:25 PM, Tudor Girba wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> One more thing.
>>>>>
>>>>> It can also be that when you have expensive traversals in your
blocks, you can easily get to quadratic algorithms.
>>>>>
>>>>> For example, suppose you have something like this:
>>>>>
>>>>> view shape
>>>>> height: [:each | (classes select: [:target | target invokes:
each]) size].
>>>>> view nodes: classes
>>>>>
>>>>> In this case, for each class, you would traverse all classes again,
so N^2.
>>>>>
>>>>> That is why we need canonical examples first that expose complex
graphs. And those people that have a direct interest in getting Mondrian
fast would be good to help in this direction, because it can get difficult
to understand the particularities of each model :)
>>>>>
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>> Doru
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 15 Jun 2010, at 13:13, Tudor Girba wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> now something important is that mondrian is barely usable
for us:
DSM, package blueprint, torch are all slow.
>>>>>>> I would really like
to see some pragmatic solutions to be found.
Like not computing all the blocks all
over the time.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This is what we are already discussing, but until now it is not
clear what exactly generates the slowness. I believe the problem comes from
the edges, but we have to take a more systematic look.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The other thing that has an impact is that right now Mondrian
computes everything lazily, so even if the visualization appears, scrolling
might still be problematic the first time you go through the entire picture.
So, testing should also take this into account.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Doru
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Stef
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Jun 15, 2010, at 12:43 PM, Tudor Girba wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi Cyrille,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The canvas is defined in MOCanvas. This canvas is
embedded in
MOBrowser and MOEasel, which in their turn create a StandardWindow
that
holds the MOCanvas.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Just to inform the others, Cyrille is experimenting with
adding
the Athens canvas (which provides an abstraction over Cairo, Balloon and
possibly others) behind Mondrian.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>> Doru
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 15 Jun 2010, at 11:42, Cyrille Delaunay wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hello,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I have been looking a bit for the place where we set
the canvas
to use in Mondrian, but I didn't find.
>>>>>>>>> I know that
all shapes are drawn on a FormCanvas, but there is
no references to FormCanvas in
mondrian classes.
>>>>>>>>> I just saw
that there is a 'defaultCanvasClass' method in the
class Form for example,
so maybe such a method is use somewhere in the code.
>>>>>>>>> Does somoene
know the way to set a new Canvas to Mondrian ?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> Moose-dev mailing list
>>>>>>>>> Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch
>>>>>>>>> https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> www.tudorgirba.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "Presenting is storytelling."
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> www.tudorgirba.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "There are no old things, there are only old ways of
looking at
them."
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> www.tudorgirba.com
>>>
>>> "In a world where everything is moving ever faster,
>>> one might have better chances to win by moving slower."
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>
>>
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>
> --
> www.tudorgirba.com
>
> "Sometimes the best solution is not the best solution."
>
>
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