24 Oct
2011
24 Oct
'11
11:05 p.m.
ok I'll start from here... I'll get back to you guys if I run into any
problems...
On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 10:58 PM, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote:
Hi Ciprian,
That is precisely what I had in mind when I said that we need someone to do
it :).
For a list of projects, I would indeed do it like Alex is saying: by
traversing projects from squeaksource. One idea is to use the
MonticelloImporter to do it from Moose. The only thing would be to implement
the relevant metrics for this importer.
Cheers,
Doru
On 24 Oct 2011, at 22:47, Ciprian Teodorov wrote:
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PhDc Ciprian TEODOROV
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University of Brest
phone: (+33)(0) 6 08 54 73 48
mail: ciprian.teodorov(a)univ-brest.fr
www.teodorov.ro
Hi Doru,
Thank you for your answer... It's too bad we don't have these figures...
What do you say about creating a list of projects that could be used to
create such a baseline. I don't really have a precise idea about the number
of projects that we might need to compute this thing ... but I think
starting such a list might be a good idea. And then based on that we can
eventually try to get the results.
In the Book: Object-oriented Metrics in Practice the authors used 45 java
and 37
c++ systems to get these numbers ... so I think we have to find at
least 30 projects maybe.
I am not promising anything but maybe I will find some time over the next
few
weeks that I can dedicate to doing this.
What do you guys say?
On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 10:27 PM, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>
wrote:
Hi,
We do not have those thresholds for Smalltalk, yet. It would be
interesting to get
them, though. We only need someone to do it :)
Cheers,
Doru
On 24 Oct 2011, at 22:03, Ciprian Teodorov wrote:
> Thanks for your prompt answer.
>
> On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 9:13 PM, Alexandre Bergel <
alexandre.bergel(a)me.com> wrote:
> No idea about the threshold. I find system
complexity and class
blueprint quite useful to get a first impression of a system.
I then usually
visualize the dependencies.
> If I really want to understand the system,
then writing unit tests will
do the thing.
>
> I completely agree with you on these points...
> but from my point of view I think that the overviewpyramid can be a
very good
visualisation
> to quickly present your system's
complexity to others... especially
during a presentation...
> and then you can freely dive into more
detailed aspect with the system
complexity and
> class blueprint - to show specific points.
However, without a
statistically significant smalltalk baseline (the threshold)
> the pyramid doesn't convey much
information especially to an external
viewer...
>
> so my point is, since we have the java and c++ cases, why not get some
smalltalk (or maybe pharo-specific)
> numbers also - especially since Moose is
implemented in smalltalk.
>
> regards,
> ciprian
>
> Alexandre
>
>
> On 24 Oct 2011, at 16:06, Ciprian Teodorov wrote:
>
> > Hi all,
> >
> > I'm new to using moose for analyzing a rather large smalltalk project
developed during the last 16-17 years.
> > I hope that using Moose framework will
give positive insights on the
hot-spots of the system in order to improve its
structure, and make it more
maintainable.
> > The project name is Madeo
(http://stiff.univ-brest.fr/BINIOU/MADEO)
a FPGA design-automation toolkit
developed mainly by one of my PhD
supervisors (Loic Lagadec).
> >
> > To start the evaluation I believe that the overview pyramid is a very
good starting point in order to get a generic idea about the system.
> > However, I was not able to find any
smalltalk threshold values in the
moose image.
> >
> > So my question is if there is somebody having some idea about the
> > smalltalk threshold values for the OverviewPyramid.
> >
> > If yes, could you provide me these figures, and eventually point me
to a
scientific paper presenting these results.
> > If not, I'm willing to try to get
these figures myself... however I
don't really know which smalltalk projects I
could use to get good results.
Thank you very much for your attention.
Best wishes,
--
PhDc Ciprian TEODOROV
Lab-STICC/AS CNRS UMR 3192
University of Brest
phone: (+33)(0) 6 08 54 73 48
mail: ciprian.teodorov(a)univ-brest.fr
www.teodorov.ro
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phone: (+33)(0) 6 08 54 73 48
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www.teodorov.ro
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