23 Apr
2017
23 Apr
'17
10:08 p.m.
Hi,
As you could see, in Pharo we turned the Dark Theme on by default.
The question is what should we do with Moose. I think it would be great to have it working
with the Dark Theme, but the problem is that the Roassal visualizations do not appropriate
in the current theme because of two reasons:
- they were conceived on a white canvas
- the colors are hardcoded
Showing a white canvas in the Dark Theme is not an option. Either we introduce a mechanism
to adapt the visualizations to the current theme, or we keep a different theme in Moose
than in Pharo.
What do you think?
Cheers,
Doru
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Not knowing how to do something is not an argument for how it cannot be done."
23 Apr
23 Apr
10:37 p.m.
As a quick fix for Roassal we probably can make an “inverted colors canvas”.
Also when Pharo was light Moose had a white theme. Now when Pharo goes dark should we make
a black theme? :)
Cheers.
Uko
On 23 Apr 2017, at 23:08, Tudor Girba
<tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote:
Hi,
As you could see, in Pharo we turned the Dark Theme on by default.
The question is what should we do with Moose. I think it would be great to have it
working with the Dark Theme, but the problem is that the Roassal visualizations do not
appropriate in the current theme because of two reasons:
- they were conceived on a white canvas
- the colors are hardcoded
Showing a white canvas in the Dark Theme is not an option. Either we introduce a
mechanism to adapt the visualizations to the current theme, or we keep a different theme
in Moose than in Pharo.
What do you think?
Cheers,
Doru
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Not knowing how to do something is not an argument for how it cannot be
done."
_______________________________________________
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10:40 p.m.
Hi,
On Apr 23, 2017, at 10:37 PM, Yuriy Tymchuk
<yuriy.tymchuk(a)me.com> wrote:
As a quick fix for Roassal we probably can make an “inverted colors canvas”.
I think this is not necessarily a quick fix. I think this should be the first direction we
should try.
Is anyone interested in taking this on?
Cheers,
Doru
Also when Pharo was light Moose had a white theme. Now
when Pharo goes dark should we make a black theme? :)
Cheers.
Uko
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Every thing should have the right to be different."
On 23 Apr 2017, at 23:08, Tudor Girba
<tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote:
Hi,
As you could see, in Pharo we turned the Dark Theme on by default.
The question is what should we do with Moose. I think it would be great to have it
working with the Dark Theme, but the problem is that the Roassal visualizations do not
appropriate in the current theme because of two reasons:
- they were conceived on a white canvas
- the colors are hardcoded
Showing a white canvas in the Dark Theme is not an option. Either we introduce a
mechanism to adapt the visualizations to the current theme, or we keep a different theme
in Moose than in Pharo.
What do you think?
Cheers,
Doru
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Not knowing how to do something is not an argument for how it cannot be
done."
_______________________________________________
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24 Apr
24 Apr
8:44 a.m.
I can try to look at it.
However I think that we should keep Moose white in the official version and
switch in time when a proper palates management will be integrated in
Pharo.
Cheers,
-- Pavel
2017-04-23 22:40 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
Hi,
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Every thing should have the right to be different."
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On Apr 23, 2017, at 10:37 PM, Yuriy Tymchuk
<yuriy.tymchuk(a)me.com>
wrote:
As a quick fix for Roassal we probably can make an “inverted colors
canvas”.
I think this is not necessarily a quick fix. I think this should be the
first direction we should try.
Is anyone interested in taking this on?
Cheers,
Doru
Also when Pharo was light Moose had a white
theme. Now when Pharo goes
dark should we make a black theme? :)
Cheers.
Uko
> On 23 Apr 2017, at 23:08, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> As you could see, in Pharo we turned the Dark Theme on by default.
>
> The question is what should we do with Moose. I think it would be great
to
have it working with the Dark Theme, but the problem is that the Roassal
visualizations do not appropriate in the current theme because of two
reasons:
> - they were conceived on a white canvas
> - the colors are hardcoded
>
> Showing a white canvas in the Dark Theme is not an option. Either we
introduce
a mechanism to adapt the visualizations to the current theme, or
we keep a different theme in Moose than in Pharo.
>
> What do you think?
>
> Cheers,
> Doru
>
>
> --
> www.tudorgirba.com
> www.feenk.com
>
> "Not knowing how to do something is not an argument for how it cannot
be
done."
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8:49 a.m.
Hi,
On Apr 24, 2017, at 8:44 AM, Pavel Krivanek
<pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> wrote:
I can try to look at it.
Great!
However I think that we should keep Moose white in the
official version and switch in time when a proper palates management will be integrated in
Pharo.
Or we can try to do that in the context of Moose and see how far this goes.
Doru
Cheers,
-- Pavel
2017-04-23 22:40 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
Hi,
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Some battles are better lost than fought."
On Apr 23, 2017, at 10:37 PM, Yuriy Tymchuk
<yuriy.tymchuk(a)me.com> wrote:
As a quick fix for Roassal we probably can make an “inverted colors canvas”.
I think this is not necessarily a quick fix. I think this should be the first direction
we should try.
Is anyone interested in taking this on?
Cheers,
Doru
Also when Pharo was light Moose had a white
theme. Now when Pharo goes dark should we make a black theme? :)
Cheers.
Uko
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Every thing should have the right to be different."
_______________________________________________
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https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev On 23 Apr 2017, at 23:08, Tudor Girba
<tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote:
Hi,
As you could see, in Pharo we turned the Dark Theme on by default.
The question is what should we do with Moose. I think it would be great to have it
working with the Dark Theme, but the problem is that the Roassal visualizations do not
appropriate in the current theme because of two reasons:
- they were conceived on a white canvas
- the colors are hardcoded
Showing a white canvas in the Dark Theme is not an option. Either we introduce a
mechanism to adapt the visualizations to the current theme, or we keep a different theme
in Moose than in Pharo.
What do you think?
Cheers,
Doru
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Not knowing how to do something is not an argument for how it cannot be
done."
_______________________________________________
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9:01 a.m.
That was on my todo list.
Pavel, we could sync on that.
Alexandre
On Apr 24, 2017, at 8:44 AM, Pavel Krivanek
<pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> wrote:
I can try to look at it.
However I think that we should keep Moose white in the official version and switch in
time when a proper palates management will be integrated in Pharo.
Cheers,
-- Pavel
2017-04-23 22:40 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
Hi,
--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
On Apr 23, 2017, at 10:37 PM, Yuriy Tymchuk
<yuriy.tymchuk(a)me.com> wrote:
As a quick fix for Roassal we probably can make an “inverted colors canvas”.
I think this is not necessarily a quick fix. I think this should be the first direction
we should try.
Is anyone interested in taking this on?
Cheers,
Doru
Also when Pharo was light Moose had a white
theme. Now when Pharo goes dark should we make a black theme? :)
Cheers.
Uko
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Every thing should have the right to be different."
_______________________________________________
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https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev On 23 Apr 2017, at 23:08, Tudor Girba
<tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote:
Hi,
As you could see, in Pharo we turned the Dark Theme on by default.
The question is what should we do with Moose. I think it would be great to have it
working with the Dark Theme, but the problem is that the Roassal visualizations do not
appropriate in the current theme because of two reasons:
- they were conceived on a white canvas
- the colors are hardcoded
Showing a white canvas in the Dark Theme is not an option. Either we introduce a
mechanism to adapt the visualizations to the current theme, or we keep a different theme
in Moose than in Pharo.
What do you think?
Cheers,
Doru
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Not knowing how to do something is not an argument for how it cannot be
done."
_______________________________________________
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Moose-dev(a)list.inf.unibe.ch
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9:38 a.m.
On Sun, Apr 23, 2017 at 10:40:47PM +0200, Tudor Girba wrote:
Hi,
This is a quick fix, but also very ugly fix. I've done this long time ago as I
regularly switch between light and dark (I toggle it with a metalink as I don't want
to physically change the code, but that's not important here).
in `TRMorph>>#drawOn:` after `surface hasBeenFreed ifTrue: [ self createSurface ].`
you add the following
```
surface drawDuring: [ :cs |
cs paintMode restoreAfter: [
cs setPaint: Color white.
cs paintMode difference.
cs drawShape: (0 @ 0 extent: surface extent)
]
].
```
but it is really weird to state in the background that you want an object blue, and
suddenly you see it yellow (becuase it is inverted).
On discord we briefly discussed with Alex the idea of introducing themes. In principle it
is not complex work, it's just lot of it. (as there are hardcoded values all over the
place).
Peter
On Apr 23, 2017, at 10:37 PM, Yuriy Tymchuk
<yuriy.tymchuk(a)me.com> wrote:
As a quick fix for Roassal we probably can make an “inverted colors canvas”.
I think this is not necessarily a quick fix. I think this should be the first direction
we should try.
Is anyone interested in taking this on?
Cheers,
Doru
Also when Pharo was light Moose had a white
theme. Now when Pharo goes dark should we make a black theme? :)
Cheers.
Uko
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Every thing should have the right to be different."
_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
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https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev On 23 Apr 2017, at 23:08, Tudor Girba
<tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote:
Hi,
As you could see, in Pharo we turned the Dark Theme on by default.
The question is what should we do with Moose. I think it would be great to have it
working with the Dark Theme, but the problem is that the Roassal visualizations do not
appropriate in the current theme because of two reasons:
- they were conceived on a white canvas
- the colors are hardcoded
Showing a white canvas in the Dark Theme is not an option. Either we introduce a
mechanism to adapt the visualizations to the current theme, or we keep a different theme
in Moose than in Pharo.
What do you think?
Cheers,
Doru
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Not knowing how to do something is not an argument for how it cannot be
done."
_______________________________________________
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9:50 a.m.
RTMorph directly pre-fills the morph on the Morphic level.
I have partial success with inversion on the level of Athens:
[image: Vložený obrázek 1]
2017-04-24 9:38 GMT+02:00 Peter Uhnak <i.uhnak(a)gmail.com>om>:
On Sun, Apr 23, 2017 at 10:40:47PM +0200, Tudor Girba
wrote:
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Every thing should have the right to be different."
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Hi,
> On Apr 23, 2017, at 10:37 PM, Yuriy Tymchuk <yuriy.tymchuk(a)me.com>
wrote:
>
> As a quick fix for Roassal we probably can make an “inverted colors
canvas”.
I think this is not necessarily a quick fix. I think this should be the
first
direction we should try.
This is a quick fix, but also very ugly fix. I've done this long time ago
as I regularly switch between light and dark (I toggle it with a metalink
as I don't want to physically change the code, but that's not important
here).
in `TRMorph>>#drawOn:` after `surface hasBeenFreed ifTrue: [ self
createSurface ].` you add the following
```
surface drawDuring: [ :cs |
cs paintMode restoreAfter: [
cs setPaint: Color white.
cs paintMode difference.
cs drawShape: (0 @ 0 extent: surface extent)
]
].
```
but it is really weird to state in the background that you want an object
blue, and suddenly you see it yellow (becuase it is inverted).
On discord we briefly discussed with Alex the idea of introducing themes.
In principle it is not complex work, it's just lot of it. (as there are
hardcoded values all over the place).
Peter
Is anyone interested in taking this on?
Cheers,
Doru
> Also when Pharo was light Moose had a white theme. Now when Pharo goes
dark
should we make a black theme? :)
>
> Cheers.
> Uko
>
>> On 23 Apr 2017, at 23:08, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> As you could see, in Pharo we turned the Dark Theme on by default.
>>
>> The question is what should we do with Moose. I think it would be
great
to have it working with the Dark Theme, but the problem is that the
Roassal visualizations do not appropriate in the current theme because of
two reasons:
>> - they were conceived on a white canvas
>> - the colors are hardcoded
>>
>> Showing a white canvas in the Dark Theme is not an option. Either we
introduce a mechanism to adapt the visualizations to the current theme, or
we keep a different theme in Moose than in Pharo.
>>
>> What do you think?
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Doru
>>
>>
>> --
>> www.tudorgirba.com
>> www.feenk.com
>>
>> "Not knowing how to do something is not an argument for how it cannot
be done."
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9:54 a.m.
On 24/04/2017 09:38, Peter Uhnak wrote:
On discord we briefly discussed with Alex the idea of
introducing
themes. In principle it is not complex work, it's just lot of it. (as
there are hardcoded values all over the place).
Peter
Kind of ironic that as developers of reverse-engineering tools, we don't
have the tools to help us in this task (not complex, repetitive
programming) :-(
nicolas
--
Nicolas Anquetil -- MCF (HDR)
Project-Team RMod
10:10 a.m.
Hi,
On Apr 24, 2017, at 9:54 AM, Nicolas Anquetil
<Nicolas.Anquetil(a)inria.fr> wrote:
On 24/04/2017 09:38, Peter Uhnak wrote:
Why do you say that we do not have these tools? We do.
Doru
On discord we briefly discussed with Alex the
idea of introducing themes. In principle it is not complex work, it's just lot of it.
(as there are hardcoded values all over the place). Peter
Kind of ironic that as developers of reverse-engineering tools, we don't have the
tools to help us in this task (not complex, repetitive programming) :-( nicolas
--
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Project-Team RMod
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"Speaking louder won't make the point worthier."
10:50 a.m.
The PetitParser 2 UI also needs some care...
2017-04-24 10:10 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
Hi,
On Apr 24, 2017, at 9:54 AM, Nicolas Anquetil
<Nicolas.Anquetil(a)inria.fr>
wrote:
On 24/04/2017 09:38, Peter Uhnak wrote:
> On discord we briefly discussed with Alex the idea of introducing
themes. In
principle it is not complex work, it's just lot of it. (as there
are hardcoded values all over the place). Peter
Kind of ironic that as developers of reverse-engineering tools, we don't
have
the tools to help us in this task (not complex, repetitive
programming) :-(
Why do you say that we do not have these tools? We do.
Doru
nicolas
--
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Project-Team RMod
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1:31 p.m.
What do you mean?
Doru
On Apr 24, 2017, at 10:50 AM, Pavel Krivanek
<pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> wrote:
The PetitParser 2 UI also needs some care...
2017-04-24 10:10 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
Hi,
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Beauty is where we see it."
On Apr 24, 2017, at 9:54 AM, Nicolas Anquetil
<Nicolas.Anquetil(a)inria.fr> wrote:
On 24/04/2017 09:38, Peter Uhnak wrote:
Why do you say that we do not have these tools? We do.
Doru
On discord we briefly discussed with Alex the
idea of introducing themes. In principle it is not complex work, it's just lot of it.
(as there are hardcoded values all over the place). Peter
Kind of ironic that as developers of reverse-engineering tools, we don't have the
tools to help us in this task (not complex, repetitive programming) :-( nicolas
--
Nicolas Anquetil -- MCF (HDR)
Project-Team RMod
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1:37 p.m.
In the package PetitParser2-GUI-Morphic that generates graphs for grammar
elements are hardcoded colors so the viewport is white even on the dark
theme. It is not based on Roassal but on plain Morphic.
E.g. PP2Node>>#morphicProduction
-- Pavel
2017-04-24 13:31 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
What do you mean?
Doru
On Apr 24, 2017, at 10:50 AM, Pavel Krivanek
<pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
The PetitParser 2 UI also needs some care...
2017-04-24 10:10 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
Hi,
> On Apr 24, 2017, at 9:54 AM, Nicolas Anquetil <
Nicolas.Anquetil(a)inria.fr> wrote:
>
> On 24/04/2017 09:38, Peter Uhnak wrote:
>> On discord we briefly discussed with Alex the idea of introducing
themes.
In principle it is not complex work, it's just lot of it. (as there
are hardcoded values all over the place). Peter
>
> Kind of ironic that as developers of reverse-engineering tools, we
don't
have the tools to help us in this task (not complex, repetitive
programming) :-(
Why do you say that we do not have these tools? We do.
Doru
--
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www.feenk.com
"Beauty is where we see it."
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nicolas
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10:18 p.m.
I mean that this kind of work will probably involve little repetitive
operations that require little intelligence for the 2nd, 3rd, ... repetition
being able to "declare" simply the first iteration and then replicate as
simply the following ones would be nice
nicolas
On 24/04/2017 13:31, Tudor Girba wrote:
What do you mean?
Doru
--
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Project-Team RMod
On Apr 24, 2017, at 10:50 AM, Pavel Krivanek
<pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> wrote:
The PetitParser 2 UI also needs some care...
2017-04-24 10:10 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
Hi,
--
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www.feenk.com
"Beauty is where we see it."
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https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev On Apr 24, 2017, at 9:54 AM, Nicolas Anquetil
<Nicolas.Anquetil(a)inria.fr> wrote:
On 24/04/2017 09:38, Peter Uhnak wrote:
Why do you say that we do not have
these tools? We do.
Doru
On discord we briefly discussed with Alex the
idea of introducing themes. In principle it is not complex work, it's just lot of it.
(as there are hardcoded values all over the place). Peter
Kind of ironic that as
developers of reverse-engineering tools, we don't have the tools to help us in this
task (not complex, repetitive programming) :-( nicolas
--
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Project-Team RMod
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10:20 p.m.
Le 24/04/2017 à 22:18, Nicolas Anquetil a écrit :
I mean that this kind of work will probably involve
little repetitive
operations that require little intelligence for the 2nd, 3rd, ...
repetition
being able to "declare" simply the first iteration and then replicate as
simply the following ones would be nice
nicolas
IIRC Mark Rizun did a tool to automate refactoring in Pharo. He
presented it at Esug in 2015.
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30 Apr
8:08 a.m.
Hi,
On Apr 24, 2017, at 10:18 PM, Nicolas Anquetil
<nicolas.anquetil(a)inria.fr> wrote:
I mean that this kind of work will probably involve little repetitive operations that
require little intelligence for the 2nd, 3rd, ... repetition
being able to "declare" simply the first iteration and then replicate as simply
the following ones would be nice
Of course. I just do not understand why you say we do not have the tools. I just had to
refactor a significant piece of code and did it in the inspector and by using refactoring
scripts (plus the cool deprecation mechanism that rewrites at execution time).
Doru
nicolas
On 24/04/2017 13:31, Tudor Girba wrote:
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What do you mean?
Doru
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https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev On Apr 24, 2017, at 10:50 AM, Pavel Krivanek
<pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> wrote:
The PetitParser 2 UI also needs some care...
2017-04-24 10:10 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
Hi,
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https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev On Apr 24, 2017, at 9:54 AM, Nicolas Anquetil
<Nicolas.Anquetil(a)inria.fr> wrote:
On 24/04/2017 09:38, Peter Uhnak wrote:
> On discord we briefly discussed with Alex the idea of introducing themes. In
principle it is not complex work, it's just lot of it. (as there are hardcoded values
all over the place). Peter
Kind of ironic that as developers of reverse-engineering tools, we don't have the
tools to help us in this task (not complex, repetitive programming) :-(
Why do you
say that we do not have these tools? We do.
Doru
nicolas
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24 Apr
24 Apr
4:52 p.m.
It's done. Thank you very much, Alex!
We only need to tune some colors for the best result in both themes.
-- Pavel
2017-04-23 22:08 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
Hi,
As you could see, in Pharo we turned the Dark Theme on by default.
The question is what should we do with Moose. I think it would be great to
have it working with the Dark Theme, but the problem is that the Roassal
visualizations do not appropriate in the current theme because of two
reasons:
- they were conceived on a white canvas
- the colors are hardcoded
Showing a white canvas in the Dark Theme is not an option. Either we
introduce a mechanism to adapt the visualizations to the current theme, or
we keep a different theme in Moose than in Pharo.
What do you think?
Cheers,
Doru
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5:53 p.m.
I took a look at the code.
I think the transformColor: is exactly the relevant direction. But, I think there are
still two issues to be addressed:
1. The logic does not yet work for everything. For example, lightRed is can be
distinguished on white, but is barely so in the dark theme.
2. The more problematic issue is the mismatch between the script and the result.
Take a look at this example:
view := RTMondrian new.
view shape circle color: Color black.
view nodes: (1 to: 42).
view layout grid.
view
On a white theme, it looks like:
On the dark theme, it would be:
The problem is that in order to get the desired light gray result, I have to write “Color
black” and this does not work.
How about introducing the notion of a ThemedColor?
Something like
ThemedColor new
for: RTDarkTheme use: Color lightGray;
for: RTWhiteTheme use: Color black
And some derivates:
ThemedColor new
forDark: Color lightGray;
forWhite: Color black
Cheers,
Doru
On Apr 24, 2017, at 4:52 PM, Pavel Krivanek
<pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> wrote:
It's done. Thank you very much, Alex!
We only need to tune some colors for the best result in both themes.
-- Pavel
2017-04-23 22:08 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
Hi,
As you could see, in Pharo we turned the Dark Theme on by default.
The question is what should we do with Moose. I think it would be great to have it
working with the Dark Theme, but the problem is that the Roassal visualizations do not
appropriate in the current theme because of two reasons:
- they were conceived on a white canvas
- the colors are hardcoded
Showing a white canvas in the Dark Theme is not an option. Either we introduce a
mechanism to adapt the visualizations to the current theme, or we keep a different theme
in Moose than in Pharo.
What do you think?
Cheers,
Doru
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Not knowing how to do something is not an argument for how it cannot be
done."
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gets."
6:07 p.m.
I might prefer a color palette with semantic names: ColorPalette pastel16
primarySelectionColor. That can then be themed.
Stephan
Verstuurd vanaf mijn iPhone
Op 24 apr. 2017 om 17:53 heeft Tudor Girba
<tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> het volgende geschreven:
I took a look at the code.
I think the transformColor: is exactly the relevant direction. But, I think there are
still two issues to be addressed:
1. The logic does not yet work for everything. For example, lightRed is can be
distinguished on white, but is barely so in the dark theme.
2. The more problematic issue is the mismatch between the script and the result.
Take a look at this example:
view := RTMondrian new.
view shape circle color: Color black.
view nodes: (1 to: 42).
view layout grid.
view
On a white theme, it looks like:
<Playground-white.png>
On the dark theme, it would be:
<Playground-dark.png>
The problem is that in order to get the desired light gray result, I have to write “Color
black” and this does not work.
How about introducing the notion of a ThemedColor?
Something like
ThemedColor new
for: RTDarkTheme use: Color lightGray;
for: RTWhiteTheme use: Color black
And some derivates:
ThemedColor new
forDark: Color lightGray;
forWhite: Color black
Cheers,
Doru
On Apr 24, 2017, at 4:52 PM, Pavel Krivanek
<pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> wrote:
It's done. Thank you very much, Alex!
We only need to tune some colors for the best result in both themes.
-- Pavel
2017-04-23 22:08 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
Hi,
As you could see, in Pharo we turned the Dark Theme on by default.
The question is what should we do with Moose. I think it would be great to have it
working with the Dark Theme, but the problem is that the Roassal visualizations do not
appropriate in the current theme because of two reasons:
- they were conceived on a white canvas
- the colors are hardcoded
Showing a white canvas in the Dark Theme is not an option. Either we introduce a
mechanism to adapt the visualizations to the current theme, or we keep a different theme
in Moose than in Pharo.
What do you think?
Cheers,
Doru
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Not knowing how to do something is not an argument for how it cannot be
done."
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25 Apr
25 Apr
9:45 a.m.
Hi Doru,
I think the transformColor: is exactly the relevant
direction. But, I think there are still two issues to be addressed:
Yes, Pavel came along with a relatively good formular to transform colors.
Take a look at this example:
view := RTMondrian new.
view shape circle color: Color black.
view nodes: (1 to: 42).
view layout grid.
view
[…]
Something like
ThemedColor new
for: RTDarkTheme use: Color lightGray;
for: RTWhiteTheme use: Color black
And some derivates:
ThemedColor new
forDark: Color lightGray;
forWhite: Color black
Having theme raises the relevance of directly specifying colors.
In your Mondrian example, why would you want to have black nodes? Or, are you interested
in having a color that is distinct from other used colors? And this goes with
ThemedColor.
Consider this:
https://github.com/d3/d3-scale-chromatic
We could have the d3.schemeAccent palette for White Theme and d3.schemeDark2 for the Dark
theme. The users would then not directly use a color, but an index in the palette. Maybe
something like:
-=-=-=-=-=-=
view := RTMondrian new.
view shape circle color4.
view nodes: (1 to: 42).
view layout grid.
view
-=-=-=-=-=-=
Or "view shape circle colorPink.” since pink is the fourth of d3.schemeDark2
What do you think?
Let’s keep this discussion. We need to move on!
Cheers,
Alexandre
Cheers,
Doru
--
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On Apr 24, 2017, at 4:52 PM, Pavel Krivanek
<pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> wrote:
It's done. Thank you very much, Alex!
We only need to tune some colors for the best result in both themes.
-- Pavel
2017-04-23 22:08 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
Hi,
As you could see, in Pharo we turned the Dark Theme on by default.
The question is what should we do with Moose. I think it would be great to have it
working with the Dark Theme, but the problem is that the Roassal visualizations do not
appropriate in the current theme because of two reasons:
- they were conceived on a white canvas
- the colors are hardcoded
Showing a white canvas in the Dark Theme is not an option. Either we introduce a
mechanism to adapt the visualizations to the current theme, or we keep a different theme
in Moose than in Pharo.
What do you think?
Cheers,
Doru
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Not knowing how to do something is not an argument for how it cannot be
done."
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3:46 p.m.
I am really not happy with the current gray background, because it halves any color
distinction in half, so everything becomes much harder to read.
If you have black text on white background, or white text on black background it's
very distinct (as much as you can get), but when you put the color of the background in
the middle, then both white text and black text (the most distant colors) become much
harder to read.
Color black is turned into dim white, which is readable, but I find it unconfortable.
Color white is just unreadable (yes, I can read it, but I actually have to focus on the
word and cannot just glance it).
So, could we make the default background much darker (maybe the same dark as the
playground text background)?
Regarding direct color specification: yes, it is relevant (maybe not for Moose); but being
able to use custom theme instead of directly specifying the colors is also fine. (in other
words, I would like to be able to specify exactly what colors to use)
Peter
On Tue, Apr 25, 2017 at 09:45:48AM +0200, Alexandre Bergel wrote:
Hi Doru,
I think the transformColor: is exactly the
relevant direction. But, I think there are still two issues to be addressed:
Yes, Pavel came along with a relatively good formular to transform colors.
Take a look at this example:
view := RTMondrian new.
view shape circle color: Color black.
view nodes: (1 to: 42).
view layout grid.
view
[…]
Something like
ThemedColor new
for: RTDarkTheme use: Color lightGray;
for: RTWhiteTheme use: Color black
And some derivates:
ThemedColor new
forDark: Color lightGray;
forWhite: Color black
Having theme raises the relevance of directly specifying colors.
In your Mondrian example, why would you want to have black nodes? Or, are you interested
in having a color that is distinct from other used colors? And this goes with
ThemedColor.
Consider this:
https://github.com/d3/d3-scale-chromatic
We could have the d3.schemeAccent palette for White Theme and d3.schemeDark2 for the Dark
theme. The users would then not directly use a color, but an index in the palette. Maybe
something like:
-=-=-=-=-=-=
view := RTMondrian new.
view shape circle color4.
view nodes: (1 to: 42).
view layout grid.
view
-=-=-=-=-=-=
Or "view shape circle colorPink.” since pink is the fourth of d3.schemeDark2
What do you think?
Let’s keep this discussion. We need to move on!
Cheers,
Alexandre
Cheers,
Doru
--
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https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev On Apr 24, 2017, at 4:52 PM, Pavel Krivanek
<pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> wrote:
It's done. Thank you very much, Alex!
We only need to tune some colors for the best result in both themes.
-- Pavel
2017-04-23 22:08 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
Hi,
As you could see, in Pharo we turned the Dark Theme on by default.
The question is what should we do with Moose. I think it would be great to have it
working with the Dark Theme, but the problem is that the Roassal visualizations do not
appropriate in the current theme because of two reasons:
- they were conceived on a white canvas
- the colors are hardcoded
Showing a white canvas in the Dark Theme is not an option. Either we introduce a
mechanism to adapt the visualizations to the current theme, or we keep a different theme
in Moose than in Pharo.
What do you think?
Cheers,
Doru
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Not knowing how to do something is not an argument for how it cannot be
done."
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10:41 a.m.
2017-04-24 17:53 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
I took a look at the code.
I think the transformColor: is exactly the relevant direction. But, I
think there are still two issues to be addressed:
1. The logic does not yet work for everything. For example, lightRed is
can be distinguished on white, but is barely so in the dark theme.
2. The more problematic issue is the mismatch between the script and the
result.
Take a look at this example:
view := RTMondrian new.
view shape circle color: Color black.
view nodes: (1 to: 42).
view layout grid.
view
On a white theme, it looks like:
On the dark theme, it would be:
The problem is that in order to get the desired light gray result, I have
to write “Color black” and this does not work.
White is only a shade of black :-)
How about introducing the notion of a ThemedColor?
Something like
ThemedColor new
for: RTDarkTheme use: Color lightGray;
for: RTWhiteTheme use: Color black
And some derivates:
ThemedColor new
forDark: Color lightGray;
forWhite: Color black
Cheers,
Doru
On Apr 24, 2017, at 4:52 PM, Pavel Krivanek <pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
It's done. Thank you very much, Alex!
We only need to tune some colors for the best result in both themes.
-- Pavel
2017-04-23 22:08 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
Hi,
As you could see, in Pharo we turned the Dark Theme on by default.
The question is what should we do with Moose. I think it would be great to
have it working with the Dark Theme, but the problem is that the Roassal
visualizations do not appropriate in the current theme because of two
reasons:
- they were conceived on a white canvas
- the colors are hardcoded
Showing a white canvas in the Dark Theme is not an option. Either we
introduce a mechanism to adapt the visualizations to the current theme, or
we keep a different theme in Moose than in Pharo.
What do you think?
Cheers,
Doru
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Not knowing how to do something is not an argument for how it cannot be
done."
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11:16 a.m.
I do not understand the question.
Doru
On Apr 25, 2017, at 10:41 AM, Pavel Krivanek
<pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> wrote:
2017-04-24 17:53 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
I took a look at the code.
I think the transformColor: is exactly the relevant direction. But, I think there are
still two issues to be addressed:
1. The logic does not yet work for everything. For example, lightRed is can be
distinguished on white, but is barely so in the dark theme.
2. The more problematic issue is the mismatch between the script and the result.
Take a look at this example:
view := RTMondrian new.
view shape circle color: Color black.
view nodes: (1 to: 42).
view layout grid.
view
On a white theme, it looks like:
<Playground-white.png>
On the dark theme, it would be:
<Playground-dark.png>
The problem is that in order to get the desired light gray result, I have to write “Color
black” and this does not work.
White is only a shade of black :-)
How about introducing the notion of a ThemedColor?
Something like
ThemedColor new
for: RTDarkTheme use: Color lightGray;
for: RTWhiteTheme use: Color black
And some derivates:
ThemedColor new
forDark: Color lightGray;
forWhite: Color black
Cheers,
Doru
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Next time you see your life passing by, say 'hi' and get to know her."
On Apr 24, 2017, at 4:52 PM, Pavel Krivanek
<pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> wrote:
It's done. Thank you very much, Alex!
We only need to tune some colors for the best result in both themes.
-- Pavel
2017-04-23 22:08 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
Hi,
As you could see, in Pharo we turned the Dark Theme on by default.
The question is what should we do with Moose. I think it would be great to have it
working with the Dark Theme, but the problem is that the Roassal visualizations do not
appropriate in the current theme because of two reasons:
- they were conceived on a white canvas
- the colors are hardcoded
Showing a white canvas in the Dark Theme is not an option. Either we introduce a
mechanism to adapt the visualizations to the current theme, or we keep a different theme
in Moose than in Pharo.
What do you think?
Cheers,
Doru
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Not knowing how to do something is not an argument for how it cannot be
done."
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11:58 a.m.
Which question? Pavel did not ask a question :-)
Alexandre
On Apr 25, 2017, at 11:16 AM, Tudor Girba
<tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote:
I do not understand the question.
Doru
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Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
On Apr 25, 2017, at 10:41 AM, Pavel Krivanek
<pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> wrote:
2017-04-24 17:53 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
I took a look at the code.
I think the transformColor: is exactly the relevant direction. But, I think there are
still two issues to be addressed:
1. The logic does not yet work for everything. For example, lightRed is can be
distinguished on white, but is barely so in the dark theme.
2. The more problematic issue is the mismatch between the script and the result.
Take a look at this example:
view := RTMondrian new.
view shape circle color: Color black.
view nodes: (1 to: 42).
view layout grid.
view
On a white theme, it looks like:
<Playground-white.png>
On the dark theme, it would be:
<Playground-dark.png>
The problem is that in order to get the desired light gray result, I have to write “Color
black” and this does not work.
White is only a shade of black :-)
How about introducing the notion of a ThemedColor?
Something like
ThemedColor new
for: RTDarkTheme use: Color lightGray;
for: RTWhiteTheme use: Color black
And some derivates:
ThemedColor new
forDark: Color lightGray;
forWhite: Color black
Cheers,
Doru
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Next time you see your life passing by, say 'hi' and get to know
her."
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https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev On Apr 24, 2017, at 4:52 PM, Pavel Krivanek
<pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> wrote:
It's done. Thank you very much, Alex!
We only need to tune some colors for the best result in both themes.
-- Pavel
2017-04-23 22:08 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
Hi,
As you could see, in Pharo we turned the Dark Theme on by default.
The question is what should we do with Moose. I think it would be great to have it
working with the Dark Theme, but the problem is that the Roassal visualizations do not
appropriate in the current theme because of two reasons:
- they were conceived on a white canvas
- the colors are hardcoded
Showing a white canvas in the Dark Theme is not an option. Either we introduce a
mechanism to adapt the visualizations to the current theme, or we keep a different theme
in Moose than in Pharo.
What do you think?
Cheers,
Doru
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Not knowing how to do something is not an argument for how it cannot be
done."
_______________________________________________
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gets."
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12:52 p.m.
Never mind. I read the wrong thing :)
Doru
On Apr 25, 2017, at 11:58 AM, Alexandre Bergel
<alexandre.bergel(a)me.com> wrote:
Which question? Pavel did not ask a question :-)
Alexandre
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"No matter how many recipes we know, we still value a chef."
On Apr 25, 2017, at 11:16 AM, Tudor Girba
<tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote:
I do not understand the question.
Doru
--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
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https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev On Apr 25, 2017, at 10:41 AM, Pavel Krivanek
<pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> wrote:
2017-04-24 17:53 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
I took a look at the code.
I think the transformColor: is exactly the relevant direction. But, I think there are
still two issues to be addressed:
1. The logic does not yet work for everything. For example, lightRed is can be
distinguished on white, but is barely so in the dark theme.
2. The more problematic issue is the mismatch between the script and the result.
Take a look at this example:
view := RTMondrian new.
view shape circle color: Color black.
view nodes: (1 to: 42).
view layout grid.
view
On a white theme, it looks like:
<Playground-white.png>
On the dark theme, it would be:
<Playground-dark.png>
The problem is that in order to get the desired light gray result, I have to write “Color
black” and this does not work.
White is only a shade of black :-)
How about introducing the notion of a ThemedColor?
Something like
ThemedColor new
for: RTDarkTheme use: Color lightGray;
for: RTWhiteTheme use: Color black
And some derivates:
ThemedColor new
forDark: Color lightGray;
forWhite: Color black
Cheers,
Doru
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Next time you see your life passing by, say 'hi' and get to know
her."
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https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev On Apr 24, 2017, at 4:52 PM, Pavel Krivanek
<pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> wrote:
It's done. Thank you very much, Alex!
We only need to tune some colors for the best result in both themes.
-- Pavel
2017-04-23 22:08 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
Hi,
As you could see, in Pharo we turned the Dark Theme on by default.
The question is what should we do with Moose. I think it would be great to have it
working with the Dark Theme, but the problem is that the Roassal visualizations do not
appropriate in the current theme because of two reasons:
- they were conceived on a white canvas
- the colors are hardcoded
Showing a white canvas in the Dark Theme is not an option. Either we introduce a
mechanism to adapt the visualizations to the current theme, or we keep a different theme
in Moose than in Pharo.
What do you think?
Cheers,
Doru
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Not knowing how to do something is not an argument for how it cannot be
done."
_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
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_______________________________________________
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https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
“The smaller and more pervasive the hardware becomes, the more physical the software
gets."
_______________________________________________
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1:01 p.m.
So, is something like:
-=-=-=-=-=-=
view := RTMondrian new.
view shape circle color4.
view nodes: (1 to: 42).
view layout grid.
view
-=-=-=-=-=-=
acceptable?
#color4 would then pick the fourth colors of a suitable palette.
Alexandre
On Apr 25, 2017, at 12:52 PM, Tudor Girba
<tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote:
Never mind. I read the wrong thing :)
Doru
--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
On Apr 25, 2017, at 11:58 AM, Alexandre Bergel
<alexandre.bergel(a)me.com> wrote:
Which question? Pavel did not ask a question :-)
Alexandre
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"No matter how many recipes we know, we still value a chef."
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https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev On Apr 25, 2017, at 11:16 AM, Tudor Girba
<tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote:
I do not understand the question.
Doru
--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
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https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev On Apr 25, 2017, at 10:41 AM, Pavel Krivanek
<pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> wrote:
2017-04-24 17:53 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
I took a look at the code.
I think the transformColor: is exactly the relevant direction. But, I think there are
still two issues to be addressed:
1. The logic does not yet work for everything. For example, lightRed is can be
distinguished on white, but is barely so in the dark theme.
2. The more problematic issue is the mismatch between the script and the result.
Take a look at this example:
view := RTMondrian new.
view shape circle color: Color black.
view nodes: (1 to: 42).
view layout grid.
view
On a white theme, it looks like:
<Playground-white.png>
On the dark theme, it would be:
<Playground-dark.png>
The problem is that in order to get the desired light gray result, I have to write “Color
black” and this does not work.
White is only a shade of black :-)
How about introducing the notion of a ThemedColor?
Something like
ThemedColor new
for: RTDarkTheme use: Color lightGray;
for: RTWhiteTheme use: Color black
And some derivates:
ThemedColor new
forDark: Color lightGray;
forWhite: Color black
Cheers,
Doru
> On Apr 24, 2017, at 4:52 PM, Pavel Krivanek <pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>
> It's done. Thank you very much, Alex!
> We only need to tune some colors for the best result in both themes.
>
> -- Pavel
>
> 2017-04-23 22:08 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
> Hi,
>
> As you could see, in Pharo we turned the Dark Theme on by default.
>
> The question is what should we do with Moose. I think it would be great to have it
working with the Dark Theme, but the problem is that the Roassal visualizations do not
appropriate in the current theme because of two reasons:
> - they were conceived on a white canvas
> - the colors are hardcoded
>
> Showing a white canvas in the Dark Theme is not an option. Either we introduce a
mechanism to adapt the visualizations to the current theme, or we keep a different theme
in Moose than in Pharo.
>
> What do you think?
>
> Cheers,
> Doru
>
>
> --
> www.tudorgirba.com
> www.feenk.com
>
> "Not knowing how to do something is not an argument for how it cannot be
done."
>
> _______________________________________________
> Moose-dev mailing list
> Moose-dev(a)list.inf.unibe.ch
> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
>
> _______________________________________________
> Moose-dev mailing list
> Moose-dev(a)list.inf.unibe.ch
> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
“The smaller and more pervasive the hardware becomes, the more physical the software
gets."
_______________________________________________
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_______________________________________________
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--
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www.feenk.com
"Next time you see your life passing by, say 'hi' and get to know
her."
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30 Apr
30 Apr
8:07 a.m.
Hi,
I think this is difficult to demo and teach (and I do this a lot) because “color4” is
obscure. Perhaps we can alleviate the problem by giving more domain names like:
- primary color
- emphasis color
- secondary emphasis color
But, I think there can be a nice middle ground. If, we introduce a ThemedColor like I said
before, then “primaryColor” is nothing but an instance of that.
I would leave plain colors unaltered. So:
view shape circle color: Color red.
should always be drawn red. This will be very useful during demos.
If we want to transform it, we can introduce a transformation method in Color that applies
the formula of Pavel and that assumes that the color was meant relative to white.
Maybe, something like: Color red asThemed.
What do you think?
Doru
On Apr 25, 2017, at 1:01 PM, Alexandre Bergel
<alexandre.bergel(a)me.com> wrote:
So, is something like:
-=-=-=-=-=-=
view := RTMondrian new.
view shape circle color4.
view nodes: (1 to: 42).
view layout grid.
view
-=-=-=-=-=-=
acceptable?
#color4 would then pick the fourth colors of a suitable palette.
Alexandre
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"We cannot reach the flow of things unless we let go."
On Apr 25, 2017, at 12:52 PM, Tudor Girba
<tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote:
Never mind. I read the wrong thing :)
Doru
--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
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https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev On Apr 25, 2017, at 11:58 AM, Alexandre Bergel
<alexandre.bergel(a)me.com> wrote:
Which question? Pavel did not ask a question :-)
Alexandre
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"No matter how many recipes we know, we still value a chef."
_______________________________________________
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https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev On Apr 25, 2017, at 11:16 AM, Tudor Girba
<tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote:
I do not understand the question.
Doru
> On Apr 25, 2017, at 10:41 AM, Pavel Krivanek <pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> 2017-04-24 17:53 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
> I took a look at the code.
>
> I think the transformColor: is exactly the relevant direction. But, I think there are
still two issues to be addressed:
>
> 1. The logic does not yet work for everything. For example, lightRed is can be
distinguished on white, but is barely so in the dark theme.
>
> 2. The more problematic issue is the mismatch between the script and the result.
>
> Take a look at this example:
> view := RTMondrian new.
> view shape circle color: Color black.
> view nodes: (1 to: 42).
> view layout grid.
> view
>
> On a white theme, it looks like:
>
> <Playground-white.png>
>
> On the dark theme, it would be:
>
> <Playground-dark.png>
>
> The problem is that in order to get the desired light gray result, I have to write
“Color black” and this does not work.
>
> White is only a shade of black :-)
>
>
> How about introducing the notion of a ThemedColor?
>
> Something like
> ThemedColor new
> for: RTDarkTheme use: Color lightGray;
> for: RTWhiteTheme use: Color black
>
> And some derivates:
>
> ThemedColor new
> forDark: Color lightGray;
> forWhite: Color black
>
>
> Cheers,
> Doru
>
>
>> On Apr 24, 2017, at 4:52 PM, Pavel Krivanek <pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
>>
>> It's done. Thank you very much, Alex!
>> We only need to tune some colors for the best result in both themes.
>>
>> -- Pavel
>>
>> 2017-04-23 22:08 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
>> Hi,
>>
>> As you could see, in Pharo we turned the Dark Theme on by default.
>>
>> The question is what should we do with Moose. I think it would be great to have
it working with the Dark Theme, but the problem is that the Roassal visualizations do not
appropriate in the current theme because of two reasons:
>> - they were conceived on a white canvas
>> - the colors are hardcoded
>>
>> Showing a white canvas in the Dark Theme is not an option. Either we introduce a
mechanism to adapt the visualizations to the current theme, or we keep a different theme
in Moose than in Pharo.
>>
>> What do you think?
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Doru
>>
>>
>> --
>> www.tudorgirba.com
>> www.feenk.com
>>
>> "Not knowing how to do something is not an argument for how it cannot be
done."
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Moose-dev mailing list
>> Moose-dev(a)list.inf.unibe.ch
>> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Moose-dev mailing list
>> Moose-dev(a)list.inf.unibe.ch
>> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
>
> --
> www.tudorgirba.com
> www.feenk.com
>
> “The smaller and more pervasive the hardware becomes, the more physical the software
gets."
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Moose-dev mailing list
> Moose-dev(a)list.inf.unibe.ch
> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Moose-dev mailing list
> Moose-dev(a)list.inf.unibe.ch
> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Next time you see your life passing by, say 'hi' and get to know
her."
_______________________________________________
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--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
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4 May
4 May
5:55 p.m.
Hi,
Can we continue this thread?
Cheers,
Doru
On Apr 30, 2017, at 8:07 AM, Tudor Girba
<tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote:
Hi,
I think this is difficult to demo and teach (and I do this a lot) because “color4” is
obscure. Perhaps we can alleviate the problem by giving more domain names like:
- primary color
- emphasis color
- secondary emphasis color
But, I think there can be a nice middle ground. If, we introduce a ThemedColor like I
said before, then “primaryColor” is nothing but an instance of that.
I would leave plain colors unaltered. So:
view shape circle color: Color red.
should always be drawn red. This will be very useful during demos.
If we want to transform it, we can introduce a transformation method in Color that
applies the formula of Pavel and that assumes that the color was meant relative to white.
Maybe, something like: Color red asThemed.
What do you think?
Doru
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"Problem solving efficiency grows with the abstractness level of problem
understanding."
On Apr 25, 2017, at 1:01 PM, Alexandre Bergel
<alexandre.bergel(a)me.com> wrote:
So, is something like:
-=-=-=-=-=-=
view := RTMondrian new.
view shape circle color4.
view nodes: (1 to: 42).
view layout grid.
view
-=-=-=-=-=-=
acceptable?
#color4 would then pick the fourth colors of a suitable palette.
Alexandre
--
www.tudorgirba.com
www.feenk.com
"We cannot reach the flow of things unless we let go."
On Apr 25, 2017, at 12:52 PM, Tudor Girba
<tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote:
Never mind. I read the wrong thing :)
Doru
--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
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https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev On Apr 25, 2017, at 11:58 AM, Alexandre Bergel
<alexandre.bergel(a)me.com> wrote:
Which question? Pavel did not ask a question :-)
Alexandre
> On Apr 25, 2017, at 11:16 AM, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote:
>
> I do not understand the question.
>
> Doru
>
>
>> On Apr 25, 2017, at 10:41 AM, Pavel Krivanek <pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> 2017-04-24 17:53 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
>> I took a look at the code.
>>
>> I think the transformColor: is exactly the relevant direction. But, I think there
are still two issues to be addressed:
>>
>> 1. The logic does not yet work for everything. For example, lightRed is can be
distinguished on white, but is barely so in the dark theme.
>>
>> 2. The more problematic issue is the mismatch between the script and the result.
>>
>> Take a look at this example:
>> view := RTMondrian new.
>> view shape circle color: Color black.
>> view nodes: (1 to: 42).
>> view layout grid.
>> view
>>
>> On a white theme, it looks like:
>>
>> <Playground-white.png>
>>
>> On the dark theme, it would be:
>>
>> <Playground-dark.png>
>>
>> The problem is that in order to get the desired light gray result, I have to
write “Color black” and this does not work.
>>
>> White is only a shade of black :-)
>>
>>
>> How about introducing the notion of a ThemedColor?
>>
>> Something like
>> ThemedColor new
>> for: RTDarkTheme use: Color lightGray;
>> for: RTWhiteTheme use: Color black
>>
>> And some derivates:
>>
>> ThemedColor new
>> forDark: Color lightGray;
>> forWhite: Color black
>>
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Doru
>>
>>
>>> On Apr 24, 2017, at 4:52 PM, Pavel Krivanek <pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
>>>
>>> It's done. Thank you very much, Alex!
>>> We only need to tune some colors for the best result in both themes.
>>>
>>> -- Pavel
>>>
>>> 2017-04-23 22:08 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> As you could see, in Pharo we turned the Dark Theme on by default.
>>>
>>> The question is what should we do with Moose. I think it would be great to
have it working with the Dark Theme, but the problem is that the Roassal visualizations do
not appropriate in the current theme because of two reasons:
>>> - they were conceived on a white canvas
>>> - the colors are hardcoded
>>>
>>> Showing a white canvas in the Dark Theme is not an option. Either we
introduce a mechanism to adapt the visualizations to the current theme, or we keep a
different theme in Moose than in Pharo.
>>>
>>> What do you think?
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Doru
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> www.tudorgirba.com
>>> www.feenk.com
>>>
>>> "Not knowing how to do something is not an argument for how it cannot be
done."
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Moose-dev mailing list
>>> Moose-dev(a)list.inf.unibe.ch
>>> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Moose-dev mailing list
>>> Moose-dev(a)list.inf.unibe.ch
>>> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
>>
>> --
>> www.tudorgirba.com
>> www.feenk.com
>>
>> “The smaller and more pervasive the hardware becomes, the more physical the
software gets."
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Moose-dev mailing list
>> Moose-dev(a)list.inf.unibe.ch
>> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Moose-dev mailing list
>> Moose-dev(a)list.inf.unibe.ch
>> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
>
> --
> www.tudorgirba.com
> www.feenk.com
>
> "Next time you see your life passing by, say 'hi' and get to know
her."
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Moose-dev mailing list
> Moose-dev(a)list.inf.unibe.ch
> https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev
--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
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www.feenk.com
"No matter how many recipes we know, we still value a chef."
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8 May
8 May
9:35 p.m.
Can we continue this thread?
:-)
Yes. I like what you propose. Primary Color, emphasis Color…
Having #asThemed is also easy to have. It is orthogonal actually.
The last few weeks have been intense. I will do a major overhaul of the coloring in
Roassal very soon. This is crucial.
The default colors of Mondrian and Grapher also need to be completely rethought.
Alexandre
On Apr 30, 2017, at 8:07 AM, Tudor Girba
<tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote:
Hi,
I think this is difficult to demo and teach (and I do this a lot) because “color4” is
obscure. Perhaps we can alleviate the problem by giving more domain names like:
- primary color
- emphasis color
- secondary emphasis color
But, I think there can be a nice middle ground. If, we introduce a ThemedColor like I
said before, then “primaryColor” is nothing but an instance of that.
I would leave plain colors unaltered. So:
view shape circle color: Color red.
should always be drawn red. This will be very useful during demos.
If we want to transform it, we can introduce a transformation method in Color that
applies the formula of Pavel and that assumes that the color was meant relative to white.
Maybe, something like: Color red asThemed.
What do you think?
Doru
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https://www.list.inf.unibe.ch/listinfo/moose-dev On Apr 25, 2017, at 1:01 PM, Alexandre Bergel
<alexandre.bergel(a)me.com> wrote:
So, is something like:
-=-=-=-=-=-=
view := RTMondrian new.
view shape circle color4.
view nodes: (1 to: 42).
view layout grid.
view
-=-=-=-=-=-=
acceptable?
#color4 would then pick the fourth colors of a suitable palette.
Alexandre
--
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On Apr 25, 2017, at 12:52 PM, Tudor Girba
<tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote:
Never mind. I read the wrong thing :)
Doru
> On Apr 25, 2017, at 11:58 AM, Alexandre Bergel <alexandre.bergel(a)me.com>
wrote:
>
> Which question? Pavel did not ask a question :-)
>
> Alexandre
>
>
>> On Apr 25, 2017, at 11:16 AM, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote:
>>
>> I do not understand the question.
>>
>> Doru
>>
>>
>>> On Apr 25, 2017, at 10:41 AM, Pavel Krivanek <pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 2017-04-24 17:53 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
>>> I took a look at the code.
>>>
>>> I think the transformColor: is exactly the relevant direction. But, I think
there are still two issues to be addressed:
>>>
>>> 1. The logic does not yet work for everything. For example, lightRed is can
be distinguished on white, but is barely so in the dark theme.
>>>
>>> 2. The more problematic issue is the mismatch between the script and the
result.
>>>
>>> Take a look at this example:
>>> view := RTMondrian new.
>>> view shape circle color: Color black.
>>> view nodes: (1 to: 42).
>>> view layout grid.
>>> view
>>>
>>> On a white theme, it looks like:
>>>
>>> <Playground-white.png>
>>>
>>> On the dark theme, it would be:
>>>
>>> <Playground-dark.png>
>>>
>>> The problem is that in order to get the desired light gray result, I have to
write “Color black” and this does not work.
>>>
>>> White is only a shade of black :-)
>>>
>>>
>>> How about introducing the notion of a ThemedColor?
>>>
>>> Something like
>>> ThemedColor new
>>> for: RTDarkTheme use: Color lightGray;
>>> for: RTWhiteTheme use: Color black
>>>
>>> And some derivates:
>>>
>>> ThemedColor new
>>> forDark: Color lightGray;
>>> forWhite: Color black
>>>
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Doru
>>>
>>>
>>>> On Apr 24, 2017, at 4:52 PM, Pavel Krivanek
<pavel.krivanek(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> It's done. Thank you very much, Alex!
>>>> We only need to tune some colors for the best result in both themes.
>>>>
>>>> -- Pavel
>>>>
>>>> 2017-04-23 22:08 GMT+02:00 Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>om>:
>>>> Hi,
>>>>
>>>> As you could see, in Pharo we turned the Dark Theme on by default.
>>>>
>>>> The question is what should we do with Moose. I think it would be great
to have it working with the Dark Theme, but the problem is that the Roassal visualizations
do not appropriate in the current theme because of two reasons:
>>>> - they were conceived on a white canvas
>>>> - the colors are hardcoded
>>>>
>>>> Showing a white canvas in the Dark Theme is not an option. Either we
introduce a mechanism to adapt the visualizations to the current theme, or we keep a
different theme in Moose than in Pharo.
>>>>
>>>> What do you think?
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> Doru
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> www.tudorgirba.com
>>>> www.feenk.com
>>>>
>>>> "Not knowing how to do something is not an argument for how it
cannot be done."
>>>>
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>>>
>>> “The smaller and more pervasive the hardware becomes, the more physical the
software gets."
>>>
>>>
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>>
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>>
>> "Next time you see your life passing by, say 'hi' and get to know
her."
>>
>>
>>
>>
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28 comments
8 participants
participants (8)
-
Alexandre Bergel -
Cyril Ferlicot D. -
Nicolas Anquetil -
Pavel Krivanek -
Peter Uhnak -
Stephan Eggermont -
Tudor Girba -
Yuriy Tymchuk