8:53 p.m.
Hi all!
I want to make a visualization of a graph (nodes and edges), but applying
ForceLayout to it takes forever, because the graph has too many elements.
if I apply TreeLayout, for example, the view renders almost instantly. Is
there some other Layout, similar to ForceLayout, but faster, for so many
elements?
Thanks!
9:05 p.m.
You can see a semi-overview of layouts here
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/31543901/AgileVisualization/Layout/01...
or inside image in Roassal Examples > Layouts
It may be my imagination, but I think Natalia Tymchuk was working on a
faster version?
In any case, you can specify number of iterations for ForceBasedLayout with
nbIterations:
~~~~~~~~~~~~~
RTForceBasedLayout new
nbIterations: 1000;
on: elements.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~
obviously with fewer iterations the layout will get worse.
Also, how many elements is "many"?
Peter
On Wed, Jul 29, 2015 at 8:53 PM, Demian Schkolnik <demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com
wrote:
Hi all!
I want to make a visualization of a graph (nodes and edges), but applying
ForceLayout to it takes forever, because the graph has too many elements.
if I apply TreeLayout, for example, the view renders almost instantly. Is
there some other Layout, similar to ForceLayout, but faster, for so many
elements?
Thanks!
_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch
https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev
9:11 p.m.
This is a hard problem that many in the graph theory have spent a lot of time on.
Reduce the amount of iterations maybe. This layout is useful when you do not have any
apparent structure in your data. What is the structure of your data?
Alexandre
--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
On Jul 29, 2015, at 3:53 PM, Demian Schkolnik
<demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com> wrote:
Hi all!
I want to make a visualization of a graph (nodes and edges), but applying ForceLayout to
it takes forever, because the graph has too many elements. if I apply TreeLayout, for
example, the view renders almost instantly. Is there some other Layout, similar to
ForceLayout, but faster, for so many elements?
Thanks!
_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch
https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev
9:16 p.m.
Hello! i will try fewer iterations. I think I may have between 200 and 500
elements total.. I will try it out inmediately and let you know.
El mié., 29 de jul. de 2015 a la(s) 4:13 p. m., Alexandre Bergel <
alexandre.bergel(a)me.com> escribió:
This is a hard problem that many in the graph theory have spent a lot
of
time on.
Reduce the amount of iterations maybe. This layout is useful when you do
not have any apparent structure in your data. What is the structure of your
data?
Alexandre
--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
On Jul 29, 2015, at 3:53 PM, Demian Schkolnik <demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
Hi all!
I want to make a visualization of a graph (nodes and edges), but applying
ForceLayout to it takes forever, because the graph has too many elements.
if I apply TreeLayout, for example, the view renders almost instantly. Is
there some other Layout, similar to ForceLayout, but faster, for so many
elements?
Thanks!
_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch
https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev
_______________________________________________
Moose-dev mailing list
Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch
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10:05 p.m.
So, I tried with 10 iterations, and it gets stuck anyway. I counted the
elements, and there are ~500 nodes and ~500 edges in my graph... Again, I
do not need nothing fancy, with having just all elements NOT clustered
together in the middle (like with no layout), I'm ok.. (well, tree layout
does not work for me due to the fact that it lays out a row of 500 elements
to the side- not bringing visibillity). Thanks again!
El mié., 29 de jul. de 2015 a la(s) 4:16 p. m., Demian Schkolnik <
demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com> escribió:
Hello! i will try fewer iterations. I think I may have between 200
and 500
elements total.. I will try it out inmediately and let you know.
El mié., 29 de jul. de 2015 a la(s) 4:13 p. m., Alexandre Bergel <
alexandre.bergel(a)me.com> escribió:
> This is a hard problem that many in the graph theory have spent a lot of
> time on.
> Reduce the amount of iterations maybe. This layout is useful when you do
> not have any apparent structure in your data. What is the structure of your
> data?
>
> Alexandre
> --
> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
>
>
>
> On Jul 29, 2015, at 3:53 PM, Demian Schkolnik <demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> Hi all!
> I want to make a visualization of a graph (nodes and edges), but applying
> ForceLayout to it takes forever, because the graph has too many elements.
> if I apply TreeLayout, for example, the view renders almost instantly. Is
> there some other Layout, similar to ForceLayout, but faster, for so many
> elements?
> Thanks!
>
> _______________________________________________
> Moose-dev mailing list
> Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch
> https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev
>
> _______________________________________________
> Moose-dev mailing list
> Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch
> https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev
>
10:14 p.m.
I am just using GridLayout. It works really fast.
El mié., 29 de jul. de 2015 a la(s) 5:05 p. m., Demian Schkolnik <
demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com> escribió:
So, I tried with 10 iterations, and it gets stuck anyway. I counted
the
elements, and there are ~500 nodes and ~500 edges in my graph... Again, I
do not need nothing fancy, with having just all elements NOT clustered
together in the middle (like with no layout), I'm ok.. (well, tree layout
does not work for me due to the fact that it lays out a row of 500 elements
to the side- not bringing visibillity). Thanks again!
El mié., 29 de jul. de 2015 a la(s) 4:16 p. m., Demian Schkolnik <
demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com> escribió:
> Hello! i will try fewer iterations. I think I may have between 200 and
> 500 elements total.. I will try it out inmediately and let you know.
>
> El mié., 29 de jul. de 2015 a la(s) 4:13 p. m., Alexandre Bergel <
> alexandre.bergel(a)me.com> escribió:
>
>> This is a hard problem that many in the graph theory have spent a lot of
>> time on.
>> Reduce the amount of iterations maybe. This layout is useful when you do
>> not have any apparent structure in your data. What is the structure of your
>> data?
>>
>> Alexandre
>> --
>> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
>> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
>> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Jul 29, 2015, at 3:53 PM, Demian Schkolnik <demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Hi all!
>> I want to make a visualization of a graph (nodes and edges), but
>> applying ForceLayout to it takes forever, because the graph has too many
>> elements. if I apply TreeLayout, for example, the view renders almost
>> instantly. Is there some other Layout, similar to ForceLayout, but faster,
>> for so many elements?
>> Thanks!
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Moose-dev mailing list
>> Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch
>> https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Moose-dev mailing list
>> Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch
>> https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev
>>
>
10:21 p.m.
Of course it does. But, perhaps at least you can try circle layout.
Doru
On Wed, Jul 29, 2015 at 10:14 PM, Demian Schkolnik <
demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com> wrote:
I am just using GridLayout. It works really fast.
El mié., 29 de jul. de 2015 a la(s) 5:05 p. m., Demian Schkolnik <
demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com> escribió:
> So, I tried with 10 iterations, and it gets stuck anyway. I counted the
> elements, and there are ~500 nodes and ~500 edges in my graph... Again, I
> do not need nothing fancy, with having just all elements NOT clustered
> together in the middle (like with no layout), I'm ok.. (well, tree layout
> does not work for me due to the fact that it lays out a row of 500 elements
> to the side- not bringing visibillity). Thanks again!
>
> El mié., 29 de jul. de 2015 a la(s) 4:16 p. m., Demian Schkolnik <
> demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com> escribió:
>
>> Hello! i will try fewer iterations. I think I may have between 200 and
>> 500 elements total.. I will try it out inmediately and let you know.
>>
>> El mié., 29 de jul. de 2015 a la(s) 4:13 p. m., Alexandre Bergel <
>> alexandre.bergel(a)me.com> escribió:
>>
>>> This is a hard problem that many in the graph theory have spent a lot
>>> of time on.
>>> Reduce the amount of iterations maybe. This layout is useful when you
>>> do not have any apparent structure in your data. What is the structure of
>>> your data?
>>>
>>> Alexandre
>>> --
>>> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
>>> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
>>> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Jul 29, 2015, at 3:53 PM, Demian Schkolnik <
>>> demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi all!
>>> I want to make a visualization of a graph (nodes and edges), but
>>> applying ForceLayout to it takes forever, because the graph has too many
>>> elements. if I apply TreeLayout, for example, the view renders almost
>>> instantly. Is there some other Layout, similar to ForceLayout, but faster,
>>> for so many elements?
>>> Thanks!
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Moose-dev mailing list
>>> Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch
>>> https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Moose-dev mailing list
>>> Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch
>>> https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev
>>>
>>
_______________________________________________
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--
www.tudorgirba.com
"Every thing has its own flow"
11:21 p.m.
Can you send a screenshot?
It's hard to judge the complexity of RTForceBasedLayout since the
implementation is quite complex, but I see at least one what looks like
O(V^2) (RTForceBasedLayout>>accumulate: method)... and that's just for a
single step.
So for 500 nodes that's 0.25M operations per step?
Google tells me that this can be as fast as O(V log(V)) so maybe this is
worth looking into sometime. (And Natalia was most certainly talking about
this at ESUG).
Peter
On Wed, Jul 29, 2015 at 10:21 PM, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com> wrote:
Of course it does. But, perhaps at least you can try circle layout.
Doru
On Wed, Jul 29, 2015 at 10:14 PM, Demian Schkolnik <
demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> I am just using GridLayout. It works really fast.
>
> El mié., 29 de jul. de 2015 a la(s) 5:05 p. m., Demian Schkolnik <
> demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com> escribió:
>
>> So, I tried with 10 iterations, and it gets stuck anyway. I counted the
>> elements, and there are ~500 nodes and ~500 edges in my graph... Again, I
>> do not need nothing fancy, with having just all elements NOT clustered
>> together in the middle (like with no layout), I'm ok.. (well, tree layout
>> does not work for me due to the fact that it lays out a row of 500 elements
>> to the side- not bringing visibillity). Thanks again!
>>
>> El mié., 29 de jul. de 2015 a la(s) 4:16 p. m., Demian Schkolnik <
>> demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com> escribió:
>>
>>> Hello! i will try fewer iterations. I think I may have between 200 and
>>> 500 elements total.. I will try it out inmediately and let you know.
>>>
>>> El mié., 29 de jul. de 2015 a la(s) 4:13 p. m., Alexandre Bergel <
>>> alexandre.bergel(a)me.com> escribió:
>>>
>>>> This is a hard problem that many in the graph theory have spent a lot
>>>> of time on.
>>>> Reduce the amount of iterations maybe. This layout is useful when you
>>>> do not have any apparent structure in your data. What is the structure
of
>>>> your data?
>>>>
>>>> Alexandre
>>>> --
>>>> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
>>>> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
>>>> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Jul 29, 2015, at 3:53 PM, Demian Schkolnik <
>>>> demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hi all!
>>>> I want to make a visualization of a graph (nodes and edges), but
>>>> applying ForceLayout to it takes forever, because the graph has too many
>>>> elements. if I apply TreeLayout, for example, the view renders almost
>>>> instantly. Is there some other Layout, similar to ForceLayout, but
faster,
>>>> for so many elements?
>>>> Thanks!
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Moose-dev mailing list
>>>> Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch
>>>> https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Moose-dev mailing list
>>>> Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch
>>>> https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev
>>>>
>>>
> _______________________________________________
> Moose-dev mailing list
> Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch
> https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev
>
>
--
www.tudorgirba.com
"Every thing has its own flow"
_______________________________________________
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Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch
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11:25 p.m.
Sure! Here is a shot of everything in gridLayout time is less than 2
seconds.. as where with grid this takes more than 15 (I am running pharo on
a linux VM so consider it extra slow.. but anyway..)[image: graph1.png]
El mié., 29 de jul. de 2015 a la(s) 6:23 p. m., Peter Uhnák <
i.uhnak(a)gmail.com> escribió:
Can you send a screenshot?
It's hard to judge the complexity of RTForceBasedLayout since the
implementation is quite complex, but I see at least one what looks like
O(V^2) (RTForceBasedLayout>>accumulate: method)... and that's just for a
single step.
So for 500 nodes that's 0.25M operations per step?
Google tells me that this can be as fast as O(V log(V)) so maybe this is
worth looking into sometime. (And Natalia was most certainly talking about
this at ESUG).
Peter
On Wed, Jul 29, 2015 at 10:21 PM, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com>
wrote:
> Of course it does. But, perhaps at least you can try circle layout.
>
> Doru
>
> On Wed, Jul 29, 2015 at 10:14 PM, Demian Schkolnik <
> demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I am just using GridLayout. It works really fast.
>>
>> El mié., 29 de jul. de 2015 a la(s) 5:05 p. m., Demian Schkolnik <
>> demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com> escribió:
>>
>>> So, I tried with 10 iterations, and it gets stuck anyway. I counted the
>>> elements, and there are ~500 nodes and ~500 edges in my graph... Again, I
>>> do not need nothing fancy, with having just all elements NOT clustered
>>> together in the middle (like with no layout), I'm ok.. (well, tree
layout
>>> does not work for me due to the fact that it lays out a row of 500 elements
>>> to the side- not bringing visibillity). Thanks again!
>>>
>>> El mié., 29 de jul. de 2015 a la(s) 4:16 p. m., Demian Schkolnik <
>>> demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com> escribió:
>>>
>>>> Hello! i will try fewer iterations. I think I may have between 200 and
>>>> 500 elements total.. I will try it out inmediately and let you know.
>>>>
>>>> El mié., 29 de jul. de 2015 a la(s) 4:13 p. m., Alexandre Bergel <
>>>> alexandre.bergel(a)me.com> escribió:
>>>>
>>>>> This is a hard problem that many in the graph theory have spent a
lot
>>>>> of time on.
>>>>> Reduce the amount of iterations maybe. This layout is useful when
you
>>>>> do not have any apparent structure in your data. What is the
structure of
>>>>> your data?
>>>>>
>>>>> Alexandre
>>>>> --
>>>>> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
>>>>> Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
>>>>> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Jul 29, 2015, at 3:53 PM, Demian Schkolnik <
>>>>> demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi all!
>>>>> I want to make a visualization of a graph (nodes and edges), but
>>>>> applying ForceLayout to it takes forever, because the graph has too
many
>>>>> elements. if I apply TreeLayout, for example, the view renders
almost
>>>>> instantly. Is there some other Layout, similar to ForceLayout, but
faster,
>>>>> for so many elements?
>>>>> Thanks!
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Moose-dev mailing list
>>>>> Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch
>>>>> https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Moose-dev mailing list
>>>>> Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch
>>>>> https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev
>>>>>
>>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Moose-dev mailing list
>> Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch
>> https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> www.tudorgirba.com
>
> "Every thing has its own flow"
>
> _______________________________________________
> Moose-dev mailing list
> Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch
> https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev
>
>
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3:21 p.m.
Hi Peter,
This layout is actually a copy from the layout in D3. It uses a complexity n*log n.
I have just verified this as follows:
Here is what is the function n * log n :
And apparently, the force based layout performance follows the same curve.
Doing the layout on a variable number of nodes (no edges then)
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
values := (1 to: 1000 by: 100) collect: [ :it |
[v := RTView new.
es := RTBox elementsOn: (1 to: it).
v addAll: es.
RTForceBasedLayout on: es. ] timeToRun
].
(values collect: #asMilliseconds) plot
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Making the number of edges varying:
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
values := (1 to: 299 by: 10) collect: [ :it |
[v := RTView new.
es := RTBox elementsOn: (1 to: 300).
v addAll: es.
edges := RTEdgeBuilder new
view: v;
elements: es;
connectFrom: [ :aValue | aValue // 2 ].
(edges copyFrom: it to: edges size) do: #remove.
RTForceBasedLayout on: es.
v] timeToRun ].
(values collect: #asMilliseconds) plot
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
All indicates that the algo we use is n log n.
Cheers,
Alexandre
--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
On Jul 29, 2015, at 6:21 PM, Peter Uhnák <i.uhnak(a)gmail.com>
wrote:
Can you send a screenshot?
It's hard to judge the complexity of RTForceBasedLayout since the implementation is
quite complex, but I see at least one what looks like O(V^2)
(RTForceBasedLayout>>accumulate: method)... and that's just for a single step.
So for 500 nodes that's 0.25M operations per step?
Google tells me that this can be as fast as O(V log(V)) so maybe this is worth looking
into sometime. (And Natalia was most certainly talking about this at ESUG).
Peter
On Wed, Jul 29, 2015 at 10:21 PM, Tudor Girba <tudor(a)tudorgirba.com
<mailto:tudor@tudorgirba.com>> wrote:
Of course it does. But, perhaps at least you can try circle layout.
Doru
On Wed, Jul 29, 2015 at 10:14 PM, Demian Schkolnik <demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com
<mailto:demianschkolnik@gmail.com>> wrote:
I am just using GridLayout. It works really fast.
El mié., 29 de jul. de 2015 a la(s) 5:05 p. m., Demian Schkolnik
<demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com <mailto:demianschkolnik@gmail.com>> escribió:
So, I tried with 10 iterations, and it gets stuck anyway. I counted the elements, and
there are ~500 nodes and ~500 edges in my graph... Again, I do not need nothing fancy,
with having just all elements NOT clustered together in the middle (like with no layout),
I'm ok.. (well, tree layout does not work for me due to the fact that it lays out a
row of 500 elements to the side- not bringing visibillity). Thanks again!
El mié., 29 de jul. de 2015 a la(s) 4:16 p. m., Demian Schkolnik
<demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com <mailto:demianschkolnik@gmail.com>> escribió:
Hello! i will try fewer iterations. I think I may have between 200 and 500 elements
total.. I will try it out inmediately and let you know.
El mié., 29 de jul. de 2015 a la(s) 4:13 p. m., Alexandre Bergel
<alexandre.bergel(a)me.com <mailto:alexandre.bergel@me.com>> escribió:
This is a hard problem that many in the graph theory have spent a lot of time on.
Reduce the amount of iterations maybe. This layout is useful when you do not have any
apparent structure in your data. What is the structure of your data?
Alexandre
--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.bergel.eu <http://www.bergel.eu/>
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
> On Jul 29, 2015, at 3:53 PM, Demian Schkolnik <demianschkolnik(a)gmail.com
<mailto:demianschkolnik@gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> Hi all!
> I want to make a visualization of a graph (nodes and edges), but applying ForceLayout
to it takes forever, because the graph has too many elements. if I apply TreeLayout, for
example, the view renders almost instantly. Is there some other Layout, similar to
ForceLayout, but faster, for so many elements?
> Thanks!
> _______________________________________________
> Moose-dev mailing list
> Moose-dev(a)iam.unibe.ch <mailto:Moose-dev@iam.unibe.ch>
> https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev
<https://www.iam.unibe.ch/mailman/listinfo/moose-dev>
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--
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"Every thing has its own flow"
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9 comments
4 participants
participants (4)
-
Alexandre Bergel -
Demian Schkolnik -
Peter Uhnák -
Tudor Girba