26 Sep
2004
26 Sep
'04
8:22 p.m.
Hi,
I'd like to run smallwiki on the university server in my home account.
But I cannot really afford to have the full cincom installation there.
Nor is it possible to have the graphical environment and so on.
Is there a way to strip the image in order to have a standalone
smallwiki service that I could run in the background of my sessions?
-- Eric
26 Sep
26 Sep
8:43 p.m.
Yes this is something called ImageStriper. Look in the doc they explain
how to deploy an application.
Eric you do not have to have all the cincom distro but I would suggest
you not to strip the image
and keep the UI so that you can access SmallWiki and load update or
other stuff with the debugger and soon.
You can have simply one image (this is what we use here one image alone
+ the VM).
Watch out this is not always as we would like it to be :)
Stef
By the way I saw how to deploy an app with dolphin Smalltalk and this
is was great:
click on button
click on some button
wait 2 min and boom you get either a dll starting at 256k or an exe
Hi,
I'd like to run smallwiki on the university server in my home account.
But I cannot really afford to have the full cincom installation there.
Nor is it possible to have the graphical environment and so on.
Is there a way to strip the image in order to have a standalone
smallwiki service that I could run in the background of my sessions?
-- Eric
8:47 p.m.
stéphane ducasse wrote:
Yes this is something called ImageStriper. Look in the
doc they explain
how to deploy an application.
Ok I'll have a look.
Eric you do not have to have all the cincom distro but
I would suggest
you not to strip the image
and keep the UI so that you can access SmallWiki and load update or
other stuff with the debugger and soon.
Yes but then how do I let smallwiki run in the background, even when I'm
logged out ?
Watch out this is not always as we would like it to be
:)
it seems :(
By the way I saw how to deploy an app with dolphin
Smalltalk and this is
was great:
click on button
click on some button
wait 2 min and boom you get either a dll starting at 256k or an exe
Nice! but this is only for windows, right? something similar for
unix/mac/linux?
-- Eric
8:58 p.m.
On 26 sept. 04, at 20:47, Eric Tanter wrote:
But stripping in VW works we already did that but this can be painful.
No this is a pity because they have Windows native widgets and MS
close
integration. Ok they have 90% of the market with them
stéphane ducasse wrote:
We use VNC to connect and then on unix I imagine that exec does that
for you, running a process that is not killing when you exit
your session
Yes this is something called ImageStriper. Look
in the doc they
explain how to deploy an application.
Ok I'll have a look.
Eric you do not have to have all the cincom
distro but I would
suggest you not to strip the image
and keep the UI so that you can access SmallWiki and load update or
other stuff with the debugger and soon.
Yes but then how do I let smallwiki run in the background, even when
I'm logged out ? Watch out this is not always as we would like it
to be :)
it seems :( By the way I saw how to deploy an app with
dolphin Smalltalk and this
is was great:
click on button
click on some button
wait 2 min and boom you get either a dll starting at 256k or an
exe
Nice! but this is only for windows, right? something similar for
unix/mac/linux?
-- Eric
27 Sep
27 Sep
4:36 p.m.
I suggest that you use RuntimePackager. Stripping need not be painful if
you decide on a conservative strip i.e. force the stripper to keep all of
your packages. However, once you have configured the RuntimePackager for
your specific project i.e. whether you had decided on an aggressive strip
strategy or a conservative one the result is an *.rtp config file, that
file from hence on can be loaded into RuntimePackager and then running
through the stripping is simple and fast.
If deploying on Windows one can then use the Reshacker tools to create a
single executable i.e. combining the vm and image and which can be
compressed by usually 50%. For Linux, Mac and the rest of the other 11
platforms that are supported by VisualWorks you will have to deliver both.
The cool thing about running headful is that one does not have to spend
time building tools to support things. Why, because one can use
workspaces, inspectors. For my wikis I use workspaces to do all sorts of
admin stuff , creating users, changing paswords, forcing snapshots, soon
garbage collection of the wiki, etc. If I had to run headless , I would
have to build all sorts of tools. Not to mention, that I can fully debug
and fix issues live. Not bad. Saves me a lot of time. Not every app needs
to run headless and many apps that usually do run headless could run
headful.
VisualWorks has quite a bit of OS support for Windows, just load the
appropriate goodies.
Finally, VisualWorks is more akin to Java i.e. in the sense that there is
the notion of a runtime environment. Dolphin does not. There is only one
environment with them and that is Windows. In the case of VisualWorks it
is possible to create a generic runtime environment (SRE - Smalltalk
Runtime Environment) with the appropriate basic support and then load the
parcels needed at runtime. I had that for something I had built that
allowed one to find parcels in a p2p network and then load them and run.
Cincom will be releasing an SRE in the next official rev, I believe.
RuntimePackager allows one to create custom environments that are specific
to the app in question, that is somewhat less useful because of the amount
of memory and disk storage that modern computers have but I guess if one
is deploying on a pocket pc device perhaps more applicable.
-Charles
On Sun, 26 Sep 2004 20:58:03 +0200, stéphane ducasse
<ducasse(a)iam.unibe.ch> wrote:
On 26 sept. 04, at 20:47, Eric Tanter wrote:
But stripping in VW works we already did that but this can be painful.
No this is a pity because they have Windows native widgets and MS
close
integration. Ok they have 90% of the market with them
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
stéphane ducasse wrote:
We use VNC to connect and then on unix I imagine that exec does that for
you, running a process that is not killing when you exit
your session
Yes this is something called ImageStriper. Look
in the doc they
explain how to deploy an application.
Ok I'll have a look.
Eric you do not have to have all the cincom
distro but I would suggest
you not to strip the image
and keep the UI so that you can access SmallWiki and load update or
other stuff with the debugger and soon.
Yes but then how do I let smallwiki run in the background, even when
I'm logged out ? Watch out this is not always as we would like it
to be :)
it seems :( By the way I saw how to deploy an app with
dolphin Smalltalk and this
is was great:
click on button
click on some button
wait 2 min and boom you get either a dll starting at 256k or an exe
Nice! but this is only for windows, right? something similar for
unix/mac/linux?
-- Eric
3:54 p.m.
Thanks charles. This is good to have other opinions.
Stef
On 27 sept. 04, at 16:36, Charles A. Monteiro wrote:
I suggest that you use RuntimePackager. Stripping need
not be painful
if you decide on a conservative strip i.e. force the stripper to keep
all of your packages. However, once you have configured the
RuntimePackager for your specific project i.e. whether you had decided
on an aggressive strip strategy or a conservative one the result is
an *.rtp config file, that file from hence on can be loaded into
RuntimePackager and then running through the stripping is simple and
fast.
If deploying on Windows one can then use the Reshacker tools to create
a single executable i.e. combining the vm and image and which can be
compressed by usually 50%. For Linux, Mac and the rest of the other 11
platforms that are supported by VisualWorks you will have to deliver
both.
The cool thing about running headful is that one does not have to
spend time building tools to support things. Why, because one can use
workspaces, inspectors. For my wikis I use workspaces to do all sorts
of admin stuff , creating users, changing paswords, forcing snapshots,
soon garbage collection of the wiki, etc. If I had to run headless , I
would have to build all sorts of tools. Not to mention, that I can
fully debug and fix issues live. Not bad. Saves me a lot of time. Not
every app needs to run headless and many apps that usually do run
headless could run headful.
VisualWorks has quite a bit of OS support for Windows, just load the
appropriate goodies.
Finally, VisualWorks is more akin to Java i.e. in the sense that there
is the notion of a runtime environment. Dolphin does not. There is
only one environment with them and that is Windows. In the case of
VisualWorks it is possible to create a generic runtime environment
(SRE - Smalltalk Runtime Environment) with the appropriate basic
support and then load the parcels needed at runtime. I had that for
something I had built that allowed one to find parcels in a p2p
network and then load them and run. Cincom will be releasing an SRE in
the next official rev, I believe. RuntimePackager allows one to create
custom environments that are specific to the app in question, that is
somewhat less useful because of the amount of memory and disk storage
that modern computers have but I guess if one is deploying on a pocket
pc device perhaps more applicable.
-Charles
On Sun, 26 Sep 2004 20:58:03 +0200, stéphane ducasse
<ducasse(a)iam.unibe.ch> wrote:
On 26 sept. 04, at 20:47, Eric Tanter wrote:
But stripping in VW works we already did that but this can be painful.
No this is a pity because they have Windows native widgets and MS
close integration. Ok they have 90% of the market with them
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
stéphane ducasse wrote:
We use VNC to connect and then on unix I imagine that exec does that
for you, running a process that is not killing when you exit
your session
Yes this is something called ImageStriper. Look
in the doc they
explain how to deploy an application.
Ok I'll have a look.
Eric you do not have to have all the cincom
distro but I would
suggest you not to strip the image
and keep the UI so that you can access SmallWiki and load update or
other stuff with the debugger and soon.
Yes but then how do I let smallwiki run in the background, even when
I'm logged out ? Watch out this is not always as we would like it
to be :)
it seems :( By the way I saw how to deploy an app with
dolphin Smalltalk and
this is was great:
click on button
click on some button
wait 2 min and boom you get either a dll starting at 256k or an
exe
Nice! but this is only for windows, right? something similar for
unix/mac/linux?
-- Eric
3:57 p.m.
Yes, quite interesting indeed, thanks !
stéphane ducasse wrote:
Thanks charles. This is good to have other opinions.
Stef
On 27 sept. 04, at 16:36, Charles A. Monteiro wrote:
--
http://www.dcc.uchile.cl/~etanter
I suggest that you use RuntimePackager. Stripping
need not be painful
if you decide on a conservative strip i.e. force the stripper to keep
all of your packages. However, once you have configured the
RuntimePackager for your specific project i.e. whether you had decided
on an aggressive strip strategy or a conservative one the result is
an *.rtp config file, that file from hence on can be loaded into
RuntimePackager and then running through the stripping is simple and
fast.
If deploying on Windows one can then use the Reshacker tools to create
a single executable i.e. combining the vm and image and which can be
compressed by usually 50%. For Linux, Mac and the rest of the other 11
platforms that are supported by VisualWorks you will have to deliver
both.
The cool thing about running headful is that one does not have to
spend time building tools to support things. Why, because one can use
workspaces, inspectors. For my wikis I use workspaces to do all sorts
of admin stuff , creating users, changing paswords, forcing snapshots,
soon garbage collection of the wiki, etc. If I had to run headless , I
would have to build all sorts of tools. Not to mention, that I can
fully debug and fix issues live. Not bad. Saves me a lot of time. Not
every app needs to run headless and many apps that usually do run
headless could run headful.
VisualWorks has quite a bit of OS support for Windows, just load the
appropriate goodies.
Finally, VisualWorks is more akin to Java i.e. in the sense that there
is the notion of a runtime environment. Dolphin does not. There is
only one environment with them and that is Windows. In the case of
VisualWorks it is possible to create a generic runtime environment
(SRE - Smalltalk Runtime Environment) with the appropriate basic
support and then load the parcels needed at runtime. I had that for
something I had built that allowed one to find parcels in a p2p
network and then load them and run. Cincom will be releasing an SRE in
the next official rev, I believe. RuntimePackager allows one to create
custom environments that are specific to the app in question, that is
somewhat less useful because of the amount of memory and disk storage
that modern computers have but I guess if one is deploying on a pocket
pc device perhaps more applicable.
-Charles
On Sun, 26 Sep 2004 20:58:03 +0200, stéphane ducasse
<ducasse(a)iam.unibe.ch> wrote:
On 26 sept. 04, at 20:47, Eric Tanter wrote:
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
stéphane ducasse wrote:
> Yes this is something called ImageStriper. Look in the doc they
> explain how to deploy an application.
Ok I'll have a look.
> Eric you do not have to have all the cincom distro but I would
> suggest you not to strip the image
> and keep the UI so that you can access SmallWiki and load update or
> other stuff with the debugger and soon.
Yes but then how do I let smallwiki run in the background, even when
I'm logged out ?
We use VNC to connect and then on unix I imagine that exec does that
for you, running a process that is not killing when you exit
your session
> Watch out this is not always as we would like it to be :)
it seems :(
But stripping in VW works we already did that but this can be painful.
> By the way I saw how to deploy an app with dolphin Smalltalk and
> this is was great:
> click on button
> click on some button
> wait 2 min and boom you get either a dll starting at 256k or an
> exe
Nice! but this is only for windows, right? something similar for
unix/mac/linux?
No this is a pity because they have Windows native widgets and MS
close integration. Ok they have 90% of the market with them
-- Eric
28 Sep
28 Sep
5:59 p.m.
For Mac you can also create one executable (like with BottomFeeder, for
example). The docs explain how to do this.
On 27 Sep 2004, at 16:36, Charles A. Monteiro wrote:
I suggest that you use RuntimePackager. Stripping need
not be painful
if you decide on a conservative strip i.e. force the stripper to keep
all of your packages. However, once you have configured the
RuntimePackager for your specific project i.e. whether you had decided
on an aggressive strip strategy or a conservative one the result is
an *.rtp config file, that file from hence on can be loaded into
RuntimePackager and then running through the stripping is simple and
fast.
If deploying on Windows one can then use the Reshacker tools to create
a single executable i.e. combining the vm and image and which can be
compressed by usually 50%. For Linux, Mac and the rest of the other 11
platforms that are supported by VisualWorks you will have to deliver
both.
The cool thing about running headful is that one does not have to
spend time building tools to support things. Why, because one can use
workspaces, inspectors. For my wikis I use workspaces to do all sorts
of admin stuff , creating users, changing paswords, forcing snapshots,
soon garbage collection of the wiki, etc. If I had to run headless , I
would have to build all sorts of tools. Not to mention, that I can
fully debug and fix issues live. Not bad. Saves me a lot of time. Not
every app needs to run headless and many apps that usually do run
headless could run headful.
VisualWorks has quite a bit of OS support for Windows, just load the
appropriate goodies.
Finally, VisualWorks is more akin to Java i.e. in the sense that there
is the notion of a runtime environment. Dolphin does not. There is
only one environment with them and that is Windows. In the case of
VisualWorks it is possible to create a generic runtime environment
(SRE - Smalltalk Runtime Environment) with the appropriate basic
support and then load the parcels needed at runtime. I had that for
something I had built that allowed one to find parcels in a p2p
network and then load them and run. Cincom will be releasing an SRE in
the next official rev, I believe. RuntimePackager allows one to create
custom environments that are specific to the app in question, that is
somewhat less useful because of the amount of memory and disk storage
that modern computers have but I guess if one is deploying on a pocket
pc device perhaps more applicable.
-Charles
On Sun, 26 Sep 2004 20:58:03 +0200, stéphane ducasse
<ducasse(a)iam.unibe.ch> wrote:
Roel Wuyts
DeComp
roel.wuyts(a)ulb.ac.be Université Libre de
Bruxelles
http://homepages.ulb.ac.be/~rowuyts/
Belgique
Board Member of the European Smalltalk User Group: www.esug.org
On 26 sept. 04, at 20:47, Eric Tanter wrote:
But stripping in VW works we already did that but this can be painful.
No this is a pity because they have Windows native widgets and MS
close integration. Ok they have 90% of the market with them
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
stéphane ducasse wrote:
We use VNC to connect and then on unix I imagine that exec does that
for you, running a process that is not killing when you exit
your session
Yes this is something called ImageStriper. Look
in the doc they
explain how to deploy an application.
Ok I'll have a look.
Eric you do not have to have all the cincom
distro but I would
suggest you not to strip the image
and keep the UI so that you can access SmallWiki and load update or
other stuff with the debugger and soon.
Yes but then how do I let smallwiki run in the background, even when
I'm logged out ? Watch out this is not always as we would like it
to be :)
it seems :( By the way I saw how to deploy an app with
dolphin Smalltalk and
this is was great:
click on button
click on some button
wait 2 min and boom you get either a dll starting at 256k or an
exe
Nice! but this is only for windows, right? something similar for
unix/mac/linux?
-- Eric
29 Sep
29 Sep
3:07 p.m.
yes, you are correct I forgot that they had come up with a similar
mechanism for MAC, which reminds that I should turn on my poor G4 double
processor once in a while, maybe I should just go ahead and put MAC OS X,
still running 9.0 :)
On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 17:59:59 +0200, Roel Wuyts <Roel.Wuyts(a)ulb.ac.be>
wrote:
For Mac you can also create one executable (like with
BottomFeeder, for
example). The docs explain how to do this.
On 27 Sep 2004, at 16:36, Charles A. Monteiro wrote:
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
I suggest that you use RuntimePackager. Stripping
need not be painful
if you decide on a conservative strip i.e. force the stripper to keep
all of your packages. However, once you have configured the
RuntimePackager for your specific project i.e. whether you had decided
on an aggressive strip strategy or a conservative one the result is an
*.rtp config file, that file from hence on can be loaded into
RuntimePackager and then running through the stripping is simple and
fast.
If deploying on Windows one can then use the Reshacker tools to create
a single executable i.e. combining the vm and image and which can be
compressed by usually 50%. For Linux, Mac and the rest of the other 11
platforms that are supported by VisualWorks you will have to deliver
both.
The cool thing about running headful is that one does not have to spend
time building tools to support things. Why, because one can use
workspaces, inspectors. For my wikis I use workspaces to do all sorts
of admin stuff , creating users, changing paswords, forcing snapshots,
soon garbage collection of the wiki, etc. If I had to run headless , I
would have to build all sorts of tools. Not to mention, that I can
fully debug and fix issues live. Not bad. Saves me a lot of time. Not
every app needs to run headless and many apps that usually do run
headless could run headful.
VisualWorks has quite a bit of OS support for Windows, just load the
appropriate goodies.
Finally, VisualWorks is more akin to Java i.e. in the sense that there
is the notion of a runtime environment. Dolphin does not. There is only
one environment with them and that is Windows. In the case of
VisualWorks it is possible to create a generic runtime environment (SRE
- Smalltalk Runtime Environment) with the appropriate basic support and
then load the parcels needed at runtime. I had that for something I had
built that allowed one to find parcels in a p2p network and then load
them and run. Cincom will be releasing an SRE in the next official rev,
I believe. RuntimePackager allows one to create custom environments
that are specific to the app in question, that is somewhat less useful
because of the amount of memory and disk storage that modern computers
have but I guess if one is deploying on a pocket pc device perhaps more
applicable.
-Charles
On Sun, 26 Sep 2004 20:58:03 +0200, stéphane ducasse
<ducasse(a)iam.unibe.ch> wrote:
Roel Wuyts
DeComp
roel.wuyts(a)ulb.ac.be Université Libre de
Bruxelles
http://homepages.ulb.ac.be/~rowuyts/
Belgique
Board Member of the European Smalltalk User Group: www.esug.org
On 26 sept. 04, at 20:47, Eric Tanter wrote:
-- Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
stéphane ducasse wrote:
> Yes this is something called ImageStriper. Look in the doc they
> explain how to deploy an application.
Ok I'll have a look.
> Eric you do not have to have all the cincom distro but I would
> suggest you not to strip the image
> and keep the UI so that you can access SmallWiki and load update or
> other stuff with the debugger and soon.
Yes but then how do I let smallwiki run in the background, even when
I'm logged out ?
We use VNC to connect and then on unix I imagine that exec does that
for you, running a process that is not killing when you exit
your session
> Watch out this is not always as we would like it to be :)
it seems :(
But stripping in VW works we already did that but this can be painful.
> By the way I saw how to deploy an app with dolphin Smalltalk and
> this is was great:
> click on button
> click on some button
> wait 2 min and boom you get either a dll starting at 256k or an
> exe
Nice! but this is only for windows, right? something similar for
unix/mac/linux?
No this is a pity because they have Windows native widgets and MS
close integration. Ok they have 90% of the market with them
-- Eric
28 Sep
28 Sep
11:49 a.m.
We use VNC to connect and then on unix I imagine that
exec does that
for you, running a process that is not killing when you exit
your session
Right. The think with stripping an image is that there is some problem with the saving
mechanism of Smallwiki. The image is saved automatically each hour and it does not work
properly with a stripped image.
I already mention this problem to the vwnc mailing list I guess... I do not know if this
has changed yet.
We use VNC on our solaris server to hold the X session, and on our mac we use the X11
server to connect to it. It works pretty fine.
However, with Squeak there should not be any problem to have a non-gui version. But we did
not find it necessary to have it here, at the University.
Bytecode modification is extremely easy to do in Smalltalk. A 10 second long example (made
with Squeak). In a workspace do the following:
Object compile: 'foo ^ 1 + 2'. "Object new foo => 3"
(Object >> #foo) at: 7 put: 177. "The bytecode 177 does a - between the
operand"
Object new foo => -1
But I guess we are loosing track of this mailing list :-)
Cheers,
Alexandre
--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.iam.unibe.ch/~bergel
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
4:16 p.m.
I'm using VW and yes I have not stripped my image. No need in my case.
Even if I did strip my image I would not have the same problem since I
don't rely on the auto image save storage mechanism but rather I built a
storage strategy that uses BOSS i.e. the contents are bossed out at
regular intervals given that there is new content to save. Finally, as
long as one has left the appropriate classes in the image there should not
be a problem in VW with doing auto image saves although in general I don't
like the idea any how.
-Charles
On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 11:49:36 +0200, Alexandre Bergel <bergel(a)iam.unibe.ch>
wrote:
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
We use VNC to
connect and then on unix I imagine that exec does that
for you, running a process that is not killing when you exit
your session
Right. The think with stripping an image is that there is some problem
with the saving mechanism of Smallwiki. The image is saved automatically
each hour and it does not work properly with a stripped image.
I already mention this problem to the vwnc mailing list I guess... I do
not know if this has changed yet.
We use VNC on our solaris server to hold the X session, and on our mac
we use the X11 server to connect to it. It works pretty fine.
However, with Squeak there should not be any problem to have a non-gui
version. But we did not find it necessary to have it here, at the
University.
Bytecode modification is extremely easy to do in Smalltalk. A 10 second
long example (made with Squeak). In a workspace do the following:
Object compile: 'foo ^ 1 + 2'. "Object new foo => 3"
(Object >> #foo) at: 7 put: 177. "The bytecode 177 does a - between the
operand"
Object new foo => -1
But I guess we are loosing track of this mailing list :-)
Cheers,
Alexandre
6:34 p.m.
I'm using VW and yes I have not stripped my image.
No need in my case.
Even if I did strip my image I would not have the same problem since I
don't rely on the auto image save storage mechanism but rather I built a
storage strategy that uses BOSS i.e. the contents are bossed out at
regular intervals given that there is new content to save. Finally, as
long as one has left the appropriate classes in the image there should not
be a problem in VW with doing auto image saves although in general I don't
like the idea any how.
Humm... I do not know much about BOSS. What is the status of your extension ? Could we use
it ? Can you recreate a wiki from the database?
Alexandre
-Charles
On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 11:49:36 +0200, Alexandre Bergel <bergel(a)iam.unibe.ch>
wrote:
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.iam.unibe.ch/~bergel
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
We use VNC
to connect and then on unix I imagine that exec does that
for you, running a process that is not killing when you exit
your session
Right. The think with stripping an image is that there is some problem
with the saving mechanism of Smallwiki. The image is saved automatically
each hour and it does not work properly with a stripped image.
I already mention this problem to the vwnc mailing list I guess... I do
not know if this has changed yet.
We use VNC on our solaris server to hold the X session, and on our mac
we use the X11 server to connect to it. It works pretty fine.
However, with Squeak there should not be any problem to have a non-gui
version. But we did not find it necessary to have it here, at the
University.
Bytecode modification is extremely easy to do in Smalltalk. A 10 second
long example (made with Squeak). In a workspace do the following:
Object compile: 'foo ^ 1 + 2'. "Object new foo => 3"
(Object >> #foo) at: 7 put: 177. "The bytecode 177 does a - between the
operand"
Object new foo => -1
But I guess we are loosing track of this mailing list :-)
Cheers,
Alexandre
7:59 p.m.
Just to be sure, this is in VW. Recreation of a wiki is done by a
configuration utility which I call Configurator, sounded like a decent
name :) The content of the wiki i.e its folders, pages, resources etc is
persisted via Boss i.e. to a file. The configurator via a config file
takes care of setting up the wiki which includes user, the appropropriate
roles and permissions and the loading of the boss file i.e. the contents.
The configurator is also told how many snapshots to keep around and can be
also told to load a specific snapshot, by default it loads the latest.
Once you have things setup as you like them re-starting a wiki is a matter
of:
Configurator startWikiFrom: aConfigFile.
If it is indeed VW that you are using , I would like to tidy things up and
probably make the user and role configuration a little easier. I currently
allow anonymoous user the capability of viewing but not editing, a normal
user can only edit pages but not folders and of course admin can do
whatever it feels like doing. Of course you can create your own roles.
Let me know if this would be useful to you and if so I'll put more focus
on it and I guess put it out in the Cincom public repository.
-Charles
On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 18:34:55 +0200, Alexandre Bergel <bergel(a)iam.unibe.ch>
wrote:
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
I'm using
VW and yes I have not stripped my image. No need in my case.
Even if I did strip my image I would not have the same problem since I
don't rely on the auto image save storage mechanism but rather I built a
storage strategy that uses BOSS i.e. the contents are bossed out at
regular intervals given that there is new content to save. Finally, as
long as one has left the appropriate classes in the image there should
not
be a problem in VW with doing auto image saves although in general I
don't
like the idea any how.
Humm... I do not know much about BOSS. What is the status of your
extension ? Could we use it ? Can you recreate a wiki from the database?
Alexandre
-Charles
On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 11:49:36 +0200, Alexandre Bergel
<bergel(a)iam.unibe.ch>
wrote:
automatically
We use VNC
to connect and then on unix I imagine that exec does that
for you, running a process that is not killing when you exit
your session
Right. The think with stripping an image is that there is some problem
with the saving mechanism of Smallwiki. The image is saved each hour and it does not work properly with a
stripped image.
I already mention this problem to the vwnc mailing list I guess... I do
not know if this has changed yet.
We use VNC on our solaris server to hold the X session, and on our mac
we use the X11 server to connect to it. It works pretty fine.
However, with Squeak there should not be any problem to have a non-gui
version. But we did not find it necessary to have it here, at the
University.
Bytecode modification is extremely easy to do in Smalltalk. A 10 second
long example (made with Squeak). In a workspace do the following:
Object compile: 'foo ^ 1 + 2'. "Object new foo => 3"
(Object >> #foo) at: 7 put: 177. "The bytecode 177 does a - between the
operand"
Object new foo => -1
But I guess we are loosing track of this mailing list :-)
Cheers,
Alexandre
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
7:09 p.m.
I read a bit about BOSS, this is similar to what Lukas did at the very beginning with
SIXX. Everything was serialized under the xml format.
I think the ideal would be to have a database behind... We have to discuss.
Alexandre
On Tue, Sep 28, 2004 at 12:59:50PM -0500, Charles A. Monteiro wrote:
Just to be sure, this is in VW. Recreation of a wiki
is done by a
configuration utility which I call Configurator, sounded like a decent
name :) The content of the wiki i.e its folders, pages, resources etc is
persisted via Boss i.e. to a file. The configurator via a config file
takes care of setting up the wiki which includes user, the appropropriate
roles and permissions and the loading of the boss file i.e. the contents.
The configurator is also told how many snapshots to keep around and can be
also told to load a specific snapshot, by default it loads the latest.
Once you have things setup as you like them re-starting a wiki is a matter
of:
Configurator startWikiFrom: aConfigFile.
If it is indeed VW that you are using , I would like to tidy things up and
probably make the user and role configuration a little easier. I currently
allow anonymoous user the capability of viewing but not editing, a normal
user can only edit pages but not folders and of course admin can do
whatever it feels like doing. Of course you can create your own roles.
Let me know if this would be useful to you and if so I'll put more focus
on it and I guess put it out in the Cincom public repository.
-Charles
On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 18:34:55 +0200, Alexandre Bergel <bergel(a)iam.unibe.ch>
wrote:
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
--
_,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
Alexandre Bergel http://www.iam.unibe.ch/~bergel
^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
I'm
using VW and yes I have not stripped my image. No need in my case.
Even if I did strip my image I would not have the same problem since I
don't rely on the auto image save storage mechanism but rather I built a
storage strategy that uses BOSS i.e. the contents are bossed out at
regular intervals given that there is new content to save. Finally, as
long as one has left the appropriate classes in the image there should
not
be a problem in VW with doing auto image saves although in general I
don't
like the idea any how.
Humm... I do not know much about BOSS. What is the status of your
extension ? Could we use it ? Can you recreate a wiki from the database?
Alexandre
-Charles
On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 11:49:36 +0200, Alexandre Bergel
<bergel(a)iam.unibe.ch>
wrote:
>We use VNC to connect and then on unix I
imagine that exec does that
>for you, running a process that is not killing when you exit
>your session
Right. The think with stripping an image is that there is some problem
with the saving mechanism of Smallwiki. The image is saved
automatically
each hour and it does not work properly with a
stripped image.
I already mention this problem to the vwnc mailing list I guess... I do
not know if this has changed yet.
We use VNC on our solaris server to hold the X session, and on our mac
we use the X11 server to connect to it. It works pretty fine.
However, with Squeak there should not be any problem to have a non-gui
version. But we did not find it necessary to have it here, at the
University.
Bytecode modification is extremely easy to do in Smalltalk. A 10 second
long example (made with Squeak). In a workspace do the following:
Object compile: 'foo ^ 1 + 2'. "Object new foo => 3"
(Object >> #foo) at: 7 put: 177. "The bytecode 177 does a - between the
operand"
Object new foo => -1
But I guess we are loosing track of this mailing list :-)
Cheers,
Alexandre
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
8:27 p.m.
yes, but there is one big difference, BOSS creates files that are at least
10x smallter than SIXX. If you create a standard wiki, add a couple pages
etc and then serialize via SIXX and compare that to serializing via BOSS
you will find a 10x difference. The difference may be even greater once
there is some real content in there. Also the time to save is of course
much, much quicker. A database would be ideal but you can probably go
quite a long ways with using Boss for your storage. EzBoard.com used it
for quite a while and they are a huge site. If I need to scale up to a
database I will probably first look into something like OminBase, a simple
OODMS available for VW, free for non-commercial purposes. Finally, one of
the benefits of a real database should be the capability of storing real
deltas. Not sure if SmallWiki as it stands can tell the storage manager
that but perhaps it is not that difficult to find out.
-Charles
On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 19:09:39 +0200, Alexandre Bergel <bergel(a)iam.unibe.ch>
wrote:
I read a bit about BOSS, this is similar to what Lukas did at the very
beginning with SIXX. Everything was serialized under the xml format.
I think the ideal would be to have a database behind... We have to
discuss.
Alexandre
On Tue, Sep 28, 2004 at 12:59:50PM -0500, Charles A. Monteiro wrote:
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
Just to be sure, this is in VW. Recreation of a
wiki is done by a
configuration utility which I call Configurator, sounded like a decent
name :) The content of the wiki i.e its folders, pages, resources etc is
persisted via Boss i.e. to a file. The configurator via a config file
takes care of setting up the wiki which includes user, the
appropropriate
roles and permissions and the loading of the boss file i.e. the
contents.
The configurator is also told how many snapshots to keep around and can
be
also told to load a specific snapshot, by default it loads the latest.
Once you have things setup as you like them re-starting a wiki is a
matter
of:
Configurator startWikiFrom: aConfigFile.
If it is indeed VW that you are using , I would like to tidy things up
and
probably make the user and role configuration a little easier. I
currently
allow anonymoous user the capability of viewing but not editing, a
normal
user can only edit pages but not folders and of course admin can do
whatever it feels like doing. Of course you can create your own roles.
Let me know if this would be useful to you and if so I'll put more focus
on it and I guess put it out in the Cincom public repository.
-Charles
On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 18:34:55 +0200, Alexandre Bergel
<bergel(a)iam.unibe.ch>
wrote:
database?
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
>I'm using VW and yes I have not stripped
my image. No need in my case.
>Even if I did strip my image I would not have the same problem since I
>don't rely on the auto image save storage mechanism but rather I
built a
storage
strategy that uses BOSS i.e. the contents are bossed out at
regular intervals given that there is new content to save. Finally, as
long as one has left the appropriate classes in the image there should
not
be a problem in VW with doing auto image saves although in general I
don't
like the idea any how.
Humm... I do not know much about BOSS. What is the status of your
extension ? Could we use it ? Can you recreate a wiki from the
Alexandre
>
>-Charles
>
>
>On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 11:49:36 +0200, Alexandre Bergel
><bergel(a)iam.unibe.ch>
>wrote:
>
>>>We use VNC to connect and then on unix I imagine that exec does that
>>>for you, running a process that is not killing when you exit
>>>your session
>>
>>Right. The think with stripping an image is that there is some
problem
>>with the saving mechanism of Smallwiki.
The image is saved
>automatically
>>each hour and it does not work properly with a stripped image.
>>
>>I already mention this problem to the vwnc mailing list I guess... I
do
>>not know if this has changed yet.
>>
>>We use VNC on our solaris server to hold the X session, and on our
mac
>>we use the X11 server to connect to it. It
works pretty fine.
>>
>>However, with Squeak there should not be any problem to have a
non-gui
>>version. But we did not find it necessary
to have it here, at the
>>University.
>>
>>
>>
>>Bytecode modification is extremely easy to do in Smalltalk. A 10
second
>>long example (made with Squeak). In a
workspace do the following:
>>Object compile: 'foo ^ 1 + 2'. "Object new foo => 3"
>>(Object >> #foo) at: 7 put: 177. "The bytecode 177 does a - between
the
>operand"
>Object new foo => -1
>
>But I guess we are loosing track of this mailing list :-)
>
>Cheers,
>Alexandre
>
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
7:49 p.m.
hi all
I think that this would be nice to have concerted effort to improve
SmallWiki.
I will publish in cincom store our latest version in which is added the
tools made by frederick.
Now it would be nice that lukas could give us an approximate schedule
for SW2.
and also how we can help him. We should get out of the bootstrap phase.
Alex I would really like that you sit with lukas and code with him
regularly.
Stef
9:18 p.m.
Are the admin tools built by Frederick compatible with Swiki 1? Have the
features of those admin tools been documented on the wiki?
On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 19:49:12 +0200, stéphane ducasse
<ducasse(a)iam.unibe.ch> wrote:
hi all
I think that this would be nice to have concerted effort to improve
SmallWiki.
I will publish in cincom store our latest version in which is added the
tools made by frederick.
Now it would be nice that lukas could give us an approximate schedule
for SW2.
and also how we can help him. We should get out of the bootstrap phase.
Alex I would really like that you sit with lukas and code with him
regularly.
Stef
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
9:10 p.m.
fredrick only worked with SW1 and this should be compatible.
For the documentation this is not that obvious but the code is in
general of good quality.
I will try to publish it.
Stef
On 28 sept. 04, at 21:18, Charles A. Monteiro wrote:
Are the admin tools built by Frederick compatible with
Swiki 1? Have
the features of those admin tools been documented on the wiki?
On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 19:49:12 +0200, stéphane ducasse
<ducasse(a)iam.unibe.ch> wrote:
hi all
I think that this would be nice to have concerted effort to improve
SmallWiki.
I will publish in cincom store our latest version in which is added
the tools made by frederick.
Now it would be nice that lukas could give us an approximate schedule
for SW2.
and also how we can help him. We should get out of the bootstrap
phase.
Alex I would really like that you sit with lukas and code with him
regularly.
Stef
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
27 Sep
27 Sep
4:38 p.m.
Also look into RuntimePackager, most VWers that I know use that instead.
On Sun, 26 Sep 2004 20:43:14 +0200, stéphane ducasse
<ducasse(a)iam.unibe.ch> wrote:
Yes this is something called ImageStriper. Look in the
doc they explain
how to deploy an application.
Eric you do not have to have all the cincom distro but I would suggest
you not to strip the image
and keep the UI so that you can access SmallWiki and load update or
other stuff with the debugger and soon.
You can have simply one image (this is what we use here one image alone
+ the VM).
Watch out this is not always as we would like it to be :)
Stef
By the way I saw how to deploy an app with dolphin Smalltalk and this is
was great:
click on button
click on some button
wait 2 min and boom you get either a dll starting at 256k or an exe
> Hi,
>
> I'd like to run smallwiki on the university server in my home account.
> But I cannot really afford to have the full cincom installation there.
> Nor is it possible to have the graphical environment and so on.
> Is there a way to strip the image in order to have a standalone
> smallwiki service that I could run in the background of my sessions?
>
> -- Eric
>
--
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
7397
days inactive
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days old
19 comments
5 participants
participants (5)
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Alexandre Bergel -
Charles A. Monteiro -
Eric Tanter -
Roel Wuyts -
stéphane ducasse