On 24 Oct 2011, at 23:47, Ciprian Teodorov wrote:
> That's cool ... from my perspective I think a metacello importer will do a better job... since it is closer to the idea of a project than the monticello repositories which sometimes are very fine grained.
>
> So if you manage to get a working version of the metacello importer please let me know. Meanwhile I'll try to figure this out using the monticello importer - importing either the whole repository or just selected packages following a handcrafted, subjective heuristic ;)
>
> On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 11:18 PM, Alexandre Bergel <
alexandre.bergel@me.com> wrote:
> I am currently working on a metacello importer. I have been slow on this due to numerous deadlines. Having someone bothering me regularly will definitely help reshuffling my todo list :-)
>
> Cheers,
> Alexandre
>
>
>
> Le 24 oct. 2011 à 17:58, Tudor Girba <
tudor@tudorgirba.com> a écrit :
>
> > Hi Ciprian,
> >
> > That is precisely what I had in mind when I said that we need someone to do it :).
> >
> > For a list of projects, I would indeed do it like Alex is saying: by traversing projects from squeaksource. One idea is to use the MonticelloImporter to do it from Moose. The only thing would be to implement the relevant metrics for this importer.
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Doru
> >
> >
> > On 24 Oct 2011, at 22:47, Ciprian Teodorov wrote:
> >
> >> Hi Doru,
> >>
> >> Thank you for your answer... It's too bad we don't have these figures... What do you say about creating a list of projects that could be used to create such a baseline. I don't really have a precise idea about the number of projects that we might need to compute this thing ... but I think starting such a list might be a good idea. And then based on that we can eventually try to get the results.
> >>
> >> In the Book: Object-oriented Metrics in Practice the authors used 45 java and 37 c++ systems to get these numbers ... so I think we have to find at least 30 projects maybe.
> >>
> >> I am not promising anything but maybe I will find some time over the next few weeks that I can dedicate to doing this.
> >>
> >> What do you guys say?
> >>
> >>
> >> On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 10:27 PM, Tudor Girba <
tudor@tudorgirba.com> wrote:
> >> Hi,
> >>
> >> We do not have those thresholds for Smalltalk, yet. It would be interesting to get them, though. We only need someone to do it :)
> >>
> >> Cheers,
> >> Doru
> >>
> >> On 24 Oct 2011, at 22:03, Ciprian Teodorov wrote:
> >>
> >>> Thanks for your prompt answer.
> >>>
> >>> On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 9:13 PM, Alexandre Bergel <
alexandre.bergel@me.com> wrote:
> >>> No idea about the threshold. I find system complexity and class blueprint quite useful to get a first impression of a system. I then usually visualize the dependencies.
> >>> If I really want to understand the system, then writing unit tests will do the thing.
> >>>
> >>> I completely agree with you on these points...
> >>> but from my point of view I think that the overviewpyramid can be a very good visualisation
> >>> to quickly present your system's complexity to others... especially during a presentation...
> >>> and then you can freely dive into more detailed aspect with the system complexity and
> >>> class blueprint - to show specific points. However, without a statistically significant smalltalk baseline (the threshold)
> >>> the pyramid doesn't convey much information especially to an external viewer...
> >>>
> >>> so my point is, since we have the java and c++ cases, why not get some smalltalk (or maybe pharo-specific)
> >>> numbers also - especially since Moose is implemented in smalltalk.
> >>>
> >>> regards,
> >>> ciprian
> >>>
> >>> Alexandre
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On 24 Oct 2011, at 16:06, Ciprian Teodorov wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Hi all,
> >>>>
> >>>> I'm new to using moose for analyzing a rather large smalltalk project developed during the last 16-17 years.
> >>>> I hope that using Moose framework will give positive insights on the hot-spots of the system in order to improve its structure, and make it more maintainable.
> >>>> The project name is Madeo (
http://stiff.univ-brest.fr/BINIOU/MADEO) a FPGA design-automation toolkit developed mainly by one of my PhD supervisors (Loic Lagadec).
> >>>>
> >>>> To start the evaluation I believe that the overview pyramid is a very good starting point in order to get a generic idea about the system.
> >>>> However, I was not able to find any smalltalk threshold values in the moose image.
> >>>>
> >>>> So my question is if there is somebody having some idea about the
> >>>> smalltalk threshold values for the OverviewPyramid.
> >>>>
> >>>> If yes, could you provide me these figures, and eventually point me to a scientific paper presenting these results.
> >>>> If not, I'm willing to try to get these figures myself... however I don't really know which smalltalk projects I could use to get good results.
> >>>>
> >>>> Thank you very much for your attention.
> >>>>
> >>>> Best wishes,
> >>>> --
> >>>> PhDc Ciprian TEODOROV
> >>>> Lab-STICC/AS CNRS UMR 3192
> >>>> University of Brest
> >>>>
> >>>> phone: (+33)(0) 6 08 54 73 48
> >>>> mail:
ciprian.teodorov@univ-brest.fr
> >>>>
www.teodorov.ro
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> Moose-dev mailing list
> >>>>
Moose-dev@iam.unibe.ch
> >>>>
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> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> _,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:
> >>> Alexandre Bergel
http://www.bergel.eu
> >>> ^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;._,.;:~^~:;.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
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> >>>
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> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> PhDc Ciprian TEODOROV
> >>> Lab-STICC/AS CNRS UMR 3192
> >>> University of Brest
> >>>
> >>> phone: (+33)(0) 6 08 54 73 48
> >>> mail:
ciprian.teodorov@univ-brest.fr
> >>>
www.teodorov.ro
> >>> _______________________________________________
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> >>>
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> >>
> >> --
> >>
www.tudorgirba.com
> >>
> >> "Next time you see your life passing by, say 'hi' and get to know her."
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
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> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> PhDc Ciprian TEODOROV
> >> Lab-STICC/AS CNRS UMR 3192
> >> University of Brest
> >>
> >> phone: (+33)(0) 6 08 54 73 48
> >> mail:
ciprian.teodorov@univ-brest.fr
> >>
www.teodorov.ro
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> >>
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> >
> > --
> >
www.tudorgirba.com
> >
> > "What we can governs what we wish."
> >
> >
> >
> >
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>
> --
> PhDc Ciprian TEODOROV
> Lab-STICC/AS CNRS UMR 3192
> University of Brest
>
> phone: (+33)(0) 6 08 54 73 48
> mail:
ciprian.teodorov@univ-brest.fr
>
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